[The Saucepan Man]

Let me add my name to the list of those noting their appreciation of this topic.

Unfortunately, I only have time for a brief comment or two.

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

I have a sense similar to Estelyn's, and given what SaucepanMan suggested on the Lord of the Bible thread thread, I would suspect that he also finds the horror muted in LotR as well.

Bb, my comment on that thread was directed more to my feeling that Tolkien had morally cleansed Faerie - "the high purged of the gross". The principal characters of Tolkien's Faerie are not the mischievous and sometimes amoral characters of traditional Faerie. But the "horrors" of the perilous realm are certainly there, as the collection of quotes that have accumulated on this thread clearly show. Gothic horror is obviously not what Tolkien is "known for", as it is not the sole constituent of his tales. But he does use the technique infrequently, where appropriate to the story.

I do not count the ever-pervasive presence of the Shadow in the East nor the seductive malice of the Ring as truly gothic elements. They are, to my mind, more essential elements of the "evil force" generally present in (and characteristic of) fantasy literature. But specific manifestations of the shadow clearly are often presented in gothic terms, as these quotes indicate.

I also agree with Anguirel and others that it is often that which is less well defined which provokes the greater horror. The description of the fell beasts is a good example of this and, reading it again, it puts me very much in mind of HP Lovecraft's tales of unimaginable horrors. One of Lovecraft's hallmarks is the manner in which he gives only glimpses of the unnameable Elder Gods that lurk in the background of his stories and he provides only patchy detail even when describing those creatures which feature prominently in them. The suggestion (and indeed the basis for much of what he wrote) is that anything more would do untold damage to our sanity.

As I said, the description of the fell beasts and some of the other quoted passages put me in mind of Lovecraft, who was primarily writing in the 1920s. I am sure that Tolkien would have been aware of him but, given the similarity of style in these passages, I wonder to what extent he may have been familiar with his work.