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Old 02-28-2006, 04:51 PM   #35
Raynor
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sarmisegethuza
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Kelvars with souls presents a host of problems; their fea must come from Eru also (no vala is capable of creating spirits); now animals arrived in Arda before even the elves (creatures "old and strong") - so incarnate fear would be allowed to awaken before the elves, but dwarves can't? And we are also told the Children of Eru (men and elves) are the creator's own addition to the music - if animals have souls, then they too are an addition, but no one is looking forward to/over them (only poor Radagast ), no one is seeking rule over them and there is no mention of them in the Ainulindale.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letter #212
Elves and Men were called the 'children of God', because they were, so to speak, a private addition to the Design, by the Creator, and one in which the Valar had no part. (Their 'themes' were introduced into the Music by the One, when the discords of Melkor arose.)
Would these animals have free will? If so, why don't the valar marvel at them, as they to at the Eruhini? Where would their souls go, to Mandos or beyond the world? If they go beyond the world, that would mean that the valar and the elves should envy even the animals. Would the animals participate in the second Ainulindale?

It is worth noting that Elves differentiate between incarnates (beings with both fea and hrondo) and animals:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quendi and Eldar, appendix B, Elvish names for the dwarves
The Eldar did not at first recognize these [the petty dwarves] as Incarnates, for they seldom caught sight of them in clear light. They only became aware of their existence indeed when they attacked the Eldar by stealth at night, or if they caught them alone in wild places. The Eldar therefore thought that they were a kind of cunning two-legged animals living in caves, and they called them Levain tad-dail, or simply Tad-dail, and they hunted them.
Would all living beings have a soul? Even the tinniest? And if not, where is the line drawn? If the animals do have souls, I am sure that there should have been a lot about them in the elvish lore, seeing how eager the elves were to learn as much as they could about their place in the world, and their relation to the valar and Men.
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