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doug*platypus · 02-22-2003, 05:31 AM

As I understand it, it was the Valar who booted Melky out into the Outer Void, and not Ilúvatar.

On a similar note, though, perhaps you are right if you are saying that the War of Wrath was an example. Although I am still not convinced that rescuing the good guys is the sole function of a Deus ex Machina, if this is in fact so, the War of Wrath is a prime example.

I agree that the use of this feature was not just Tolkien being stuck for ideas. He seems to be showing us that somewhere out there is a benevolent force that is always watching. The Eagles and the Valar do not interfere until the uttermost need, but they do not ultimately fail to protect the heroes.

JRRT paints a picture of a benevolent something out there that will not desert the world, or at least did not up until the end of the Third Age. Perhaps, sadly, when the Elves leave Middle-Earth, the Númenóreans diminish and vanish, and the Eagles stop talking and get a lot smaller, mankind has lost the right or the ability to enlist the help of this higher power.

02-22-2003, 05:31 AM	#10
doug*platypus Delver in the Deep Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Aotearoa Posts: 960	As I understand it, it was the Valar who booted Melky out into the Outer Void, and not Ilúvatar. On a similar note, though, perhaps you are right if you are saying that the War of Wrath was an example. Although I am still not convinced that rescuing the good guys is the sole function of a Deus ex Machina, if this is in fact so, the War of Wrath is a prime example. I agree that the use of this feature was not just Tolkien being stuck for ideas. He seems to be showing us that somewhere out there is a benevolent force that is always watching. The Eagles and the Valar do not interfere until the uttermost need, but they do not ultimately fail to protect the heroes. JRRT paints a picture of a benevolent something out there that will not desert the world, or at least did not up until the end of the Third Age. Perhaps, sadly, when the Elves leave Middle-Earth, the Númenóreans diminish and vanish, and the Eagles stop talking and get a lot smaller, mankind has lost the right or the ability to enlist the help of this higher power. __________________ But Gwindor answered: 'The doom lies in yourself, not in your name'.