[Evisse the Blue]

This thread did not live out its time, it should go on and on...Great discussion, everyone.

About the Void thing: this makes me think of a story by Stefan Zweig called 'Chess" where a guy was tortured by being isolated in a sparsely furnished room; and even though well fed and leading a comfortable life - the inactivity and isolation was driving him to madness. So, I imagine the Void being a place where your actions have no consequences, where screams are unanswered, where you are completely alone and forgotten by the rest of the world. One can even pity Morgoth if you consider this closely. Surely this is hellish enough.

I like Lhuna's idea of hell as a state of mind and the Eowyn example is perfect. This also ties in with Lush's idea of "suffering that results from the absence": absence of h(H?)ope. Sam also has his share of hell in Shelob's lair. There is a line there that has always evoked the height of suffering to me: "And then black despair came down on him, and Sam bowed to the ground, and drew his hood over his head, and night came into his heart and he knew no more." A descent into hell, not the body's but the soul's.

Both Sam and Eowyn are saved though. Aragorn and company emerges from the Paths of the Dead unscathed, though perhaps not unchanged. Frodo and Beren pay their tribute to the underworld, but finally they too are granted peace. Which makes me think there is no permanent hell in Middle Earth. At least not in the generally accepted sense of the word, found in religion and mythology.
Middle Earth is a far more benevolent place, it seems.

Ok let's take Orpheus for instance. He was favoured by men and gods, an exceptional person. He attempts the impossible and ventures into the underworld to rescue his beloved. He sings to the creatures and the gods there (sound familiar?) and he is apparently being granted his wish. But - there's a catch: don't look back at Eurydike. Apparently easy to do, but this is exactly when Fate plays a nasty card and he does exactly the forbidden thing, even though he knows the consequences will be dire. The stories are filled with such examples, when the hero/heroine does exactly what they are expressly forbidden to do, and hell ensues as a direct result of their actions. It doesn't matter that their intentions are good, they are not judged by their good character, but by that one mistake that they happened to make. In Middle Earth, it's not like this. Or is it?