[mark12_30]

Mithalwen and Alatar, several interesting points. May I donate a few more:

‘Indeed we have heard of Fangorn in Minas Tirith,’ said Boromir. ‘But what I have heard seems to me for the most part old wives’ tales, such as we tell to our children.....’
‘Then I need say no more,’ said Celeborn. ‘But do not despise the lore that has come down from distant years; for oft it may chance that old wives keep in memory word of things that once were needful for the wise to know.’

It has been pointed out more than once that next to Celeborn stood a very, very, very old wife, who knew a great many tales. But she was still worth listening to.

‘The Ents!’ exclaimed Aragorn. ‘Then there is truth in the old legends about the dwellers in the deep forests and the giant shepherds of the trees? Are there still Ents in the world? I thought they were only a memory of ancient days, if indeed they were ever more than a legend of Rohan.’

Was Aragorn listening when Celeborn made his point?

‘They are the shepherds of the trees,’ answered Gandalf [to Theoden]. ‘Is it so long since you listened to tales by the fireside? "

Theoden did listen to Gandalf, as we see in his next little lore-test (italics mine: )

...said Théoden. ‘So these are the lost ones of your company, Gandalf? The days are fated to be filled with marvels. Already I have seen many since I left my house; and now here before my eyes stand yet another of the folk of legend. Are not these the Halflings, that some among us call the Holbytlan?’

Even the herb-master at the houses of healing didn't get it:

Thereupon the herb-master entered. ‘Your lordship asked for kingsfoil... ... it has no virtue that we know of... ...Unless, of course, you give heed to rhymes of old days which women such as our good Ioreth still repeat without understanding.

When the black breath blows
and death’s shadow grows
and all lights pass,
come athelas! come athelas!
Life to the dying
In the king’s hand lying!

It is but a doggrel, I fear, garbled in the memory of old wives. Its meaning I leave to your judgement, if indeed it has any. But old folk still use an infusion of the herb for headaches.’

‘Then in the name of the king, go and find some old man of less lore and more wisdom who keeps some in his house!’ cried Gandalf.

Did Ioreth really repeat this rhyme without understanding? Or had the loremaster simply lost the art of listening respectfully to wise-- although sometimes very annoying-- old women?

The entire point of the passage is that, just as Celeborn had warned, "old wives keep in memory word of things that once were needful for the wise to know"-- and may be needful again. Gandalf is not long on patience, and rarely does anyone give him counsel, but look at his response to Ioreth's opening words:

Then an old wife, Ioreth, the eldest of the women who served in that house, looking on the fair face of Faramir, wept, for all the people loved him. And she said: ‘Alas! if he should die. Would that there were kings in Gondor, as there were once upon a time, they say! For it is said in old lore: The hands of the king are the hands of a healer. And so the rightful king could ever be known.’

And Gandalf, who stood by, said: ‘Men may long remember your words, Ioreth! For there is hope in them. Maybe a king has indeed returned to Gondor; or have you not heard the strange tidings that have come to the City?’

‘I have been too busy with this and that to heed all the crying and shouting,’ she answered. ‘All I hope is that those murdering devils do not come to this House and trouble the sick.’

Then Gandalf went out in haste...