[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

I love it when a thread shows us something that we all already knew, but didn't really know.

This idea of desire versus love was really right under our noses.

One of those invisible, taken for granted things that came with the territory of good versus evil, and how it would affect relationships ...

I feel all enlightened.

Once more, I am amazed at Tolkien's characterizations.

And other than that ... I can't think of anything to further progress this thread.

Well ... maybe I can.

It has to do with noble intent.

Because I think Faramir got off to a much better start with Eomer than Wormtongue did, and that was a pretty smart idea.

As a matter of fact ... if Wormtongue had any intent of attempting to 'woo' Eowyn, he was kind of out of luck. Not just because he was a bad guy, but because before Theodred died, which was only days before we met the Rohirrim, Eowyn practically had TWO brothers.

And kind of repeating the whole topic, Wormtongue viewed her as a prize. Faramir was willing to endure scorn and whatever else just to be with her ("taming one of the wild women of Rohan" and that sort of thing).

And then, there's this little bit;

Wormtongue was a coward. Faramir may have abhorred violence, but he fought anyway, for his people, for everybody.