The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum - View Single Post - Archetypes in Faerie

mark12_30 · 04-11-2003, 08:45 AM

davem, all right, I see your point. Faerie is shifting and changing, and not static.

But the point has been made before that all who came after Tolkien FEEL like cheap imitations, because Tolkien had a wizard, so anybody who has a wizard after that is obviously copying Tolkien. Same with elves, heroes, dwarves, whatnot. Fill in the blank!

Looking backward into mythologies (I for one am grateful at least to David Day for his book Tolkien's Ring) one may notice similarities and influences, and I view archetypes as one way to talk about those influences. I don't like limiting Tolkien; he tends to defy that anyway; but as a writer, I want to know, what's fair game! Okay, so if I use "hobbits", that's copyrighted. So is "Elrond" and "Valinor", and lots of other things too, I suppose. But (for example) The Tuatha De Danaan are not copyrighted. I could "use" them. Tolkien let himself be influeced by a lot of other tales, myths, and legends, faerie tales, and ... other whatnot. Even Shakespeare, in a one-upmanship sort of way...

Archetypes give me one more glimpse into what I can use. Looking at Tolkien's work through a variety of lenses, I am hoping, will help me to see which realms are exclusively his, and which realms may be shared or used as springboards.

I don't think Tolkien would have approved of all the Jung-addicts out there either, nor how they apply what they do (I did a web search on archetypes-- yyeeeesh.) But I thought the essay was a good way of looking at the Ring-quest in an elemental way, and seeing it from a different angle.

04-11-2003, 08:45 AM	#7
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	davem, all right, I see your point. Faerie is shifting and changing, and not static. But the point has been made before that all who came after Tolkien FEEL like cheap imitations, because Tolkien had a wizard, so anybody who has a wizard after that is obviously copying Tolkien. Same with elves, heroes, dwarves, whatnot. Fill in the blank! Looking backward into mythologies (I for one am grateful at least to David Day for his book Tolkien's Ring) one may notice similarities and influences, and I view archetypes as one way to talk about those influences. I don't like limiting Tolkien; he tends to defy that anyway; but as a writer, I want to know, what's fair game! Okay, so if I use "hobbits", that's copyrighted. So is "Elrond" and "Valinor", and lots of other things too, I suppose. But (for example) The Tuatha De Danaan are not copyrighted. I could "use" them. Tolkien let himself be influeced by a lot of other tales, myths, and legends, faerie tales, and ... other whatnot. Even Shakespeare, in a one-upmanship sort of way... Archetypes give me one more glimpse into what I can use. Looking at Tolkien's work through a variety of lenses, I am hoping, will help me to see which realms are exclusively his, and which realms may be shared or used as springboards. I don't think Tolkien would have approved of all the Jung-addicts out there either, nor how they apply what they do (I did a web search on archetypes-- yyeeeesh.) But I thought the essay was a good way of looking at the Ring-quest in an elemental way, and seeing it from a different angle. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.