The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum - View Single Post - I fear that PJ has failed or : "The Gollum situation"

Lyta_Underhill · 12-06-2003, 01:34 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I disagree with the idea that Gollum was definitely a "mean sort of creature" before he got the Ring because he killed Deagol for the Ring. After all, look at Boromir. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I don't think that Gollum is like Boromir in character. The thing they have in common is the Ring gains power over them. It does so in different ways. Boromir is definitely not mean, although he does have a measure of blindness. He is noble and valiant and, just...wrong about the Ring. Smeagol, on the other hand, made use of the Ring for mean purposes, such as terrorizing his grandmother's household by using it to play pranks while invisible. (I think that was in the Letters too; I'll have to dig those out soon to come up with references!) But Tolkien definitely says that Gollum was a "mean sort" when the Ring comes within his grasp. Otherwise he would not have killed Deagol outright for it. Contrast that to Boromir's slow burn and how fleeting was the complete dominion of the Ring over him when it came down to it. I think that Gollum began as this "mean sort" and the utter desolation with which the Ring leaves him in the Misty Mountains has left him plenty of time for reflection on his heinous deed. I'm sure the murder of Deagol haunts him and causes him to reconsider and wish he could turn to the good, but evil has held him so long, he is lost and does not know how to do it. This is sad in itself, a tragic characteristic, but the fact remains, that the impulse to good on Gollum's part is VERY fragile for this same reason, and Sam's outburst would not have turned a normal being sharply to the purpose of evil. Gollum's past evil definitely counts against him and in this way rules his present and future actions. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>This is rather a digression from the initial subject, but I do hope that, in the opening sequence of the Return of the King movie in which Smeagol murders Deagol, Smeagol is not portrayed as wholly or mostly Gollum-ish to begin with.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Oops! You're right! And I'm guilty too! I imagine it is a hard scene to portray, and it will be interesting to see how Smeagol comes to his decision to take the Ring from Deagol. Perhaps a struggle and he accidentally kills his friend? That would make it more poignant...oh well! I don't have long to wait! Cheers, Lyta

12-06-2003, 01:34 AM	#18
Lyta_Underhill Haunted Halfling Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: an uncounted length of steps--floating between air molecules Posts: 841	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I disagree with the idea that Gollum was definitely a "mean sort of creature" before he got the Ring because he killed Deagol for the Ring. After all, look at Boromir. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I don't think that Gollum is like Boromir in character. The thing they have in common is the Ring gains power over them. It does so in different ways. Boromir is definitely not mean, although he does have a measure of blindness. He is noble and valiant and, just...wrong about the Ring. <P>Smeagol, on the other hand, made use of the Ring for mean purposes, such as terrorizing his grandmother's household by using it to play pranks while invisible. (I think that was in the Letters too; I'll have to dig those out soon to come up with references!) But Tolkien definitely says that Gollum was a "mean sort" when the Ring comes within his grasp. Otherwise he would not have killed Deagol outright for it. Contrast that to Boromir's slow burn and how fleeting was the complete dominion of the Ring over him when it came down to it. <P>I think that Gollum began as this "mean sort" and the utter desolation with which the Ring leaves him in the Misty Mountains has left him plenty of time for reflection on his heinous deed. I'm sure the murder of Deagol haunts him and causes him to reconsider and wish he could turn to the good, but evil has held him so long, he is lost and does not know how to do it. This is sad in itself, a tragic characteristic, but the fact remains, that the impulse to good on Gollum's part is VERY fragile for this same reason, and Sam's outburst would not have turned a normal being sharply to the purpose of evil. Gollum's past evil definitely counts against him and in this way rules his present and future actions.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>This is rather a digression from the initial subject, but I do hope that, in the opening sequence of the Return of the King movie in which Smeagol murders Deagol, Smeagol is not portrayed as wholly or mostly Gollum-ish to begin with.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Oops! You're right! And I'm guilty too! I imagine it is a hard scene to portray, and it will be interesting to see how Smeagol comes to his decision to take the Ring from Deagol. Perhaps a struggle and he accidentally kills his friend? That would make it more poignant...oh well! I don't have long to wait! <P>Cheers,<BR>Lyta __________________ “…she laid herself to rest upon Cerin Amroth; and there is her green grave, until the world is changed, and all the days of her life are utterly forgotten by men that come after, and elanor and niphredil bloom no more east of the Sea.”