so do you think they are powerful enough to percieve and cast spells through their mind? Gandalf and the balrog obviously percieved each other, but neither knew what the other was. If the reference you just spoke of (Balrogs remaining silent) only refers to that certain case, then it is hard to determine an understanding of this instance. He specifically says "counter-spell". Im still not sure exactly what this means. I need to dig out my letters. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] thanks X-phial and Heron-istarion. if you stumble upon anything else please post!