The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum - View Single Post

**lindil** · 02-19-2003, 12:57 PM

Mithadan has provided a very succinct summary of the Silmarillion dilemna.

It can not truly be considered canon on the level with the four books published during his lifetime: THe Hobbitm THe LotR, The Adventures of TB and The RGEO, also there is a guide for translators included in " The Tolkien Compass".

What we are given especially in UT, and the final 3 volumes of HoME is an extremely large variety of sometimes contradictory information.

The general approach to deciding what is authoritative is to try and figure out whay the final conception was.

In the case of Galadriel and Celeborn, it was JRRT's conception of Galadriel having departed Aman seperately from the rest of the Noldor with a telerin Prince Teleporno [ the telerin version of Celeborn], and not only, not participating in Feanor's revolt [most particularly the kinslaying] but actually fighting against the feranoreans and those of the House of Fingolfin that mistakenly aided them. She and Celeborn with one or two others [ I forget which] then departed Alqualonde seperately, but still came under the Ban of the Valar.

All well and good, and indeed JRRT was by these developments expressing his ever-increasing 'understanding' of the role of Galadriel as the philisophical and Nolodorin opposite to Feanor.

It all runs aground however with the fact that the above mentioned 'final' version goes completly against what is implied in the LotR but is expressly stated in the Road Goes Ever On.

We do not know if he would have stuck with the final version and revised the previous writings to come into accord with them [ he did make numerous small and at least one very large revision [ the riddle-game and ring finding in the original Hobbit] to his works before soit is conceivable that he might have done so again, although his stated preference was to stick with whatever he had already released publicly.

There is as you see no perfect solution to the Galdriel/Celeborn question, but most 'canonists' side with taking the printed texts as a baseline and only incuding such details and stories from HoME and UT as do not conflict with JRRT's 'official' works; of which the Silmarillion is alas, not one.

The final complication comes with the aforementioned somewhat pre-mature compilation of CJRT before all of the nuances of the Legendarium could be worked out. which leads me to the following Question.

[ February 19, 2003: Message edited by: lindil ]

02-19-2003, 12:57 PM	#14
lindil Seeker of the Straight Path Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: a hidden fastness in Big Valley nor cal Posts: 1,680	Mithadan has provided a very succinct summary of the Silmarillion dilemna. It can not truly be considered canon on the level with the four books published during his lifetime: THe Hobbitm THe LotR, The Adventures of TB and The RGEO, also there is a guide for translators included in " The Tolkien Compass". What we are given especially in UT, and the final 3 volumes of HoME is an extremely large variety of sometimes contradictory information. The general approach to deciding what is authoritative is to try and figure out whay the final conception was. In the case of Galadriel and Celeborn, it was JRRT's conception of Galadriel having departed Aman seperately from the rest of the Noldor with a telerin Prince Teleporno [ the telerin version of Celeborn], and not only, not participating in Feanor's revolt [most particularly the kinslaying] but actually fighting against the feranoreans and those of the House of Fingolfin that mistakenly aided them. She and Celeborn with one or two others [ I forget which] then departed Alqualonde seperately, but still came under the Ban of the Valar. All well and good, and indeed JRRT was by these developments expressing his ever-increasing 'understanding' of the role of Galadriel as the philisophical and Nolodorin opposite to Feanor. It all runs aground however with the fact that the above mentioned 'final' version goes completly against what is implied in the LotR but is expressly stated in the Road Goes Ever On. We do not know if he would have stuck with the final version and revised the previous writings to come into accord with them [ he did make numerous small and at least one very large revision [ the riddle-game and ring finding in the original Hobbit] to his works before soit is conceivable that he might have done so again, although his stated preference was to stick with whatever he had already released publicly. There is as you see no perfect solution to the Galdriel/Celeborn question, but most 'canonists' side with taking the printed texts as a baseline and only incuding such details and stories from HoME and UT as do not conflict with JRRT's 'official' works; of which the Silmarillion is alas, not one. The final complication comes with the aforementioned somewhat pre-mature compilation of CJRT before all of the nuances of the Legendarium could be worked out. which leads me to the following Question. [ February 19, 2003: Message edited by: lindil ] __________________ The dwindling Men of the West would often sit up late into the night exchanging lore & wisdom such as they still possessed that they should not fall back into the mean estate of those who never knew or indeed rebelled against the Light.