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mark12_30 · 08-11-2002, 07:42 AM

Consider Tolkien's outlook as a catholic. Every Ash Wednesday, each catholic gets his / her forehead dotted with ash, and is carefully told:

"Remember, man, that thou art dust
And unto dust thou shalt return."

Then Tolkien created several other races that were specifically not-man. I think he did so to have something stronger to work with, something less temptable, something perhaps a bit less fallen-- and perhaps, for contrast. (I know, elves can sin, and dwarves and hobbits too. But they are stronger, less tempted, as noted above.) But man-- dust to dust, ashes to ashes. For Tolkien, as a standard Catholic, redeemption for man in his sin can only be through the incarnation, crucifiction, and resurrection-- which, in the world of Middle-Earth, hasn't happened yet. So, yes. In the Catholic viewpoint, without access to the incarnation, crucifiction and resurrection, man always fights a losing battle.

Especially when he sells his soul to the devil out of lust for power. Then he loses VERY quickly indeed.

--Helen

08-11-2002, 07:42 AM	#13
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Consider Tolkien's outlook as a catholic. Every Ash Wednesday, each catholic gets his / her forehead dotted with ash, and is carefully told: "Remember, man, that thou art dust And unto dust thou shalt return." Then Tolkien created several other races that were specifically not-man. I think he did so to have something stronger to work with, something less temptable, something perhaps a bit less fallen-- and perhaps, for contrast. (I know, elves can sin, and dwarves and hobbits too. But they are stronger, less tempted, as noted above.) But man-- dust to dust, ashes to ashes. For Tolkien, as a standard Catholic, redeemption for man in his sin can only be through the incarnation, crucifiction, and resurrection-- which, in the world of Middle-Earth, hasn't happened yet. So, yes. In the Catholic viewpoint, without access to the incarnation, crucifiction and resurrection, man always fights a losing battle. Especially when he sells his soul to the devil out of lust for power. Then he loses VERY quickly indeed. --Helen __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.