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Old 11-24-2003, 11:32 AM   #3
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This question was asked on a thread that has migrated to the 2nd page of Haudh-en-Ndengin (it's called Ealar and Incarnation).

Here's the question (asked by Maehdros)-
Quote:
Oblo, would you say that those spirits [Eagles] are maiar too, or something else.
And here is Obloquy's reply-
Quote:
Tolkien himself seems unsure. From Myths Transformed:

quote:
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Huan and Sorontar [Quenya for Thorondor] could be Maiar - emissaries of Manwë. But unfortunately in The Lord of the Rings Gwaehir and Landroval are said to be descendants of Sorontar.
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What's the difficulty with Gwaihir and Landroval being descendants of Thorondor? As far as I can surmise, it must be something to do with the beast-form of the Eagles. Is it possible for two Maiar to conceive children together? Can Maiar beget offspring without one true Incarnate involved? The idea is unprecedented -- or at least unattested. If not, could -- or would -- a Maia in eagle form mate with a true eagle? Even if it was possible, wouldn't it likely violate some major axan? Then, if it was done, would the sentient spirit of the Maia be able to pass that sentience on to progeny that was produced by two beast hröar?

In any case, in the same essay, after some discussion of orc origins/nature, he changes his mind:

quote:
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In summary: I think it must be assumed that [orcs] 'talking' is not necessarily the sign of the possession of a 'rational soul' or fëa...talking was largely echoic (cf. parrots), in The Lord of the Rings Sauron is said to have devised a language for them.... The same sort of thing may be said of Húan and the Eagles: they were taught language by the Valar, and raised to a higher level - but they still had no fëar.
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So it looks like the answer is, No, the Eagles were not Maiar (or originally any kind of ëalar), though Tolkien did consider it. What is disturbing, however, is the adjustment of Húan's nature. I think this change might be taken less seriously than that of the Eagles, since The Professor provides no reason for it, whereas he had evidently run into a problem with the Eagles' nature.
I hope that helps.
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