The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum - View Single Post - * *Revised Fall of Gondolin pt.3 [revisions to' Tuor in G.' & revisions toMaeglin] **

**lindil** · 02-23-2003, 02:49 AM

Re: the boasting section: OK I think you are right Aiwendil re: the Noldorin capability to arrogance, I suppose it is more that it is weekly written arrogance [from my pov] that gets me. But we should try and insert the material you suggested [anyone care for a mini project?] re: the eagles and appropriate watch/guards.

If I see no new suggestions within the next few days I will post some soort of proposed emmended text.

Re: the glowing axe, I see your point A. and it is true. The only possible factor that could make an exception is if in the Hobbit [which I do not have with me] there is some specific mention that all of the weapons forged in Gondolin were like this.

RE: 'good wording' If it is so that Hobbit says, 'weapons' so we could use that language straight from the Hobbit IF it fit, So as to avoid 'creative writing' which was never my intention.

There is some line like that I think, but it may only say swords. Anyway I will look it up when I get back home. But it probably is a wash for at least one of the reasons you pointed out. Too bad JRRT did not follow it up in ANY of the revised Silm accounts! Curious sense it does figure in the LotR and is not just 'Hobbit stuff' like the giants hurling boulders.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Re: the wings and feathers.

Well, I don't know. I think it says in UT that the feathers were stuck by Tuor in the CREST [i.e. top] of the helm, after they were proffered by the swans who did him homage. And wings would be on the side for certain [ I hope !] otherwise it would be one goofy helm.

I think we are talking about 2 different conceptions that just happen to have bird-connected features.
-=-=-=-=-=-

As for the alternate conception of a 2nd suit of armor, I was just offering an alternative.
In case someone else saw more merit or some benefit in it that I did not.

Making the axe the gift is far simpler and I think more directly connected to the text.

-=-=-=-=-=-=

re: the 'many years'

Well in support of this I would say that FOG had no firm timeline in mind, whereas all of the WotJ material is timed with exceeding accuracy. So we are I think staying true to the later TOY's by inserting it from there.

Also 'many years' seems a bit overstated for 7 years. So that is my main reason to suggest a change. The many seems to be a holdover from the old BoLT chronology that had GOndolin existing for long ages or somesuch. Since it seems anachronistic or at least suspect, better to replace it with a final conceptionof JRRT's that is straight from the TOY in WotJ.

Sorry I did not offer my rational [sp?] along with my proposals in the first place, I will try and make a habit of it [especially as it seems there is still uite a bit of emmending to do for the later FoG material
[img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] ]

I will try on Mon or so to type up suggested emmendations for the above sections.

Any other comments folks?

02-23-2003, 02:49 AM	#17
lindil Seeker of the Straight Path Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: a hidden fastness in Big Valley nor cal Posts: 1,680	Re: the boasting section: OK I think you are right Aiwendil re: the Noldorin capability to arrogance, I suppose it is more that it is weekly written arrogance [from my pov] that gets me. But we should try and insert the material you suggested [anyone care for a mini project?] re: the eagles and appropriate watch/guards. If I see no new suggestions within the next few days I will post some soort of proposed emmended text. Re: the glowing axe, I see your point A. and it is true. The only possible factor that could make an exception is if in the Hobbit [which I do not have with me] there is some specific mention that all of the weapons forged in Gondolin were like this. RE: 'good wording' If it is so that Hobbit says, 'weapons' so we could use that language straight from the Hobbit IF it fit, So as to avoid 'creative writing' which was never my intention. There is some line like that I think, but it may only say swords. Anyway I will look it up when I get back home. But it probably is a wash for at least one of the reasons you pointed out. Too bad JRRT did not follow it up in ANY of the revised Silm accounts! Curious sense it does figure in the LotR and is not just 'Hobbit stuff' like the giants hurling boulders. -=-=-=-=-=-=- Re: the wings and feathers. Well, I don't know. I think it says in UT that the feathers were stuck by Tuor in the CREST [i.e. top] of the helm, after they were proffered by the swans who did him homage. And wings would be on the side for certain [ I hope !] otherwise it would be one goofy helm. I think we are talking about 2 different conceptions that just happen to have bird-connected features. -=-=-=-=-=- As for the alternate conception of a 2nd suit of armor, I was just offering an alternative. In case someone else saw more merit or some benefit in it that I did not. Making the axe the gift is far simpler and I think more directly connected to the text. -=-=-=-=-=-= re: the 'many years' Well in support of this I would say that FOG had no firm timeline in mind, whereas all of the WotJ material is timed with exceeding accuracy. So we are I think staying true to the later TOY's by inserting it from there. Also 'many years' seems a bit overstated for 7 years. So that is my main reason to suggest a change. The many seems to be a holdover from the old BoLT chronology that had GOndolin existing for long ages or somesuch. Since it seems anachronistic or at least suspect, better to replace it with a final conceptionof JRRT's that is straight from the TOY in WotJ. Sorry I did not offer my rational [sp?] along with my proposals in the first place, I will try and make a habit of it [especially as it seems there is still uite a bit of emmending to do for the later FoG material [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] ] I will try on Mon or so to type up suggested emmendations for the above sections. Any other comments folks? __________________ The dwindling Men of the West would often sit up late into the night exchanging lore & wisdom such as they still possessed that they should not fall back into the mean estate of those who never knew or indeed rebelled against the Light.