what was the point?
 

why did Aragorn carry around a broken sword before he journeyed to Rivendell with the hobbits? it's kinda hard to defend yourself with a broken sword. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

Aragorn had two heirlooms of his line of kings - the ring of Barahir & the the shards of Elendil's sword Narsil. They were given to him by Elrond who had them in his keeping at Rivendell. At that time Elrond revealed the true name of Aragorn (who was called Estel while being fostered by Elrond), his ancestry, and the ancient prophecy of his House. When, many years later, Aragorn decided the time was right to fulfill the prophecy, he had the sword that was broken reforged and renamed it Anduril. and the rest so to speak was history.

I am sure that he also had a more serviceable blade that he used in his pre-king years against his foes.

btw - welcome to the Downs!!!!

Mae govannan Rilwen. Elen silla lumenn' omentielvo. (Well met Rilwen. A star shines on the hour of our meeting.)

Post often.

Rilwen does have a point, Piosenniel. When he meets with the Hobbits in Bree, he is only carrying Narsil, which he draws and shows to Frodo. And at Weathertop he only has the flaming torches to combat the Nazgul.

I can't think that Aragorn carried Narsil with him everywhere; such a precious heirloom wouldn't be carried around in the Wilderness for all those years. It must have been kept in a safe place up until that time.

I imagine that Strider knew with the discovery of the Ring that his time had come at last, and intentionally chose to carry the sword that was broken to Rivendell, so that it could be reforged there.

Since I'm no swordsperson, I'd have to ask if carrying the broken sword made it too unwieldy to carry a more functional weapon as well?

I'm not sure whether Strider had a blade with him on Weathertop, but if it was useful( and Strider would have known so) he would have used it along with the flaming brands.
But didn't the blades that the hobbits carried from the barrow-wight's tomb have magical spells wound in them? And actually Merry's blade is the one that helped smite the Witchking himself. It would have made a formidable foe on Weathertop, no? If Strider had such a distinguishable blade, I'm sure he would have used it.

Welcome Rilwen! You should enjoy your stay here, especially if all your posts are as good as this one. ~_^ Mae govannen!

Hail and well met rilwen! Hope to see you among the many frequent posters from now on!

hey welcome and i must say that if u are traveling the land and think u might ecounter deadly perils and things of the sort u would want to carry a weapon other than a broken sword even if it is narsil.

I'm out of town at the moment and so don't have my books with me, but I don't believe there's any statement that Narsil is the only weapon that Strider has. I'm not a swordswoman of any sort but would imagine that carrying two swords, one on each side, could get kind of awkward (unless you were ambidextrous) and carrying two on the same side would lead to obvious complications when you reached for one and accidentally grabbed the wrong hilt. So at a guess, Narsil is probably the only sword with him, which he carries for its power and symbolism. OTOH there was nothing to prevent him carrying long knives or a bow on his back, or possibly both. That would have made sense, especially since in his years in the wild, a lot of the threats/foes he met were as likely to be nonhuman as human. And if he was hunting for meat, a bow and knife would be much more useful than a sword of any kind.

yes but dont u think it kinda strange it is never mentioned that he had somethin of the kind. And in the many fantasy novels i have read it is common to where a sword across ones's back.

I am *bumping* this thread, because I am a longtime admirer of Aragorn's!
This topic has long eluded me.
I used to take for granted that Aragorn was a powerful enough man and that his presence was enough to let others know not to mess with him. This still does not explain why he used no other blade!

After much thinking, I have come to a conclusion - that when Elrond placed Narsil in his protection (at the age of twenty along with the Ring of Barahir)perhaps it was fortold that he would carry no other blade. Was this the ultimate challenge? Go out into the wild, with nothing but the blade of your forefathers! It will be the token of your birthright? Aragorn seems to have wandered into the woods thereafter, feeling rather high and mighty (according to the Appendix.)
However, if Aragorn wore the Ring of Barahir into battle (another token) it is not said early on in the LOTR.

I have experience with blades. In this case,
the shard of Narsil that was left upon the swordhilt is enough to defend one's self with. The loss of balance would be noticable, but the blade would move faster in one's hand, being lighter. Rather than a sword, it might be used as a quick-blade.

I think that we should do well to note that men of wisdom and power rarely need weapons to defend themselves. Aragorn did not seek Orcs in the service of Gandalf and the Fellowship, although it is said that he killed several Wargs. Did he do it with Narsil? It was the only blade he had at the time...
I will give you time to ponder this while i look for more plausible answers on the net. I have not tried a search on it; there may be more available these days.

*edit: Found: a possible answer:
"the blade was in two pieces "a foot below the hilt"...(but LENGTHWISE? Basically, he was using an odd-shaped rapier.)"
This is plausible. What do you think?

[ September 07, 2002: Message edited by: Tirned Tinnu ]

It is entirely plausible that the broken sword was useful. It is also entirely plausible that the mere presence of Narsil had a powerful effect on the servants of Sauron. Intimidation can sometimes come in handy much more so than a tangible weapon.

Remember: the Nazgul's main power was the terror they struck in the hearts of men. Narsil, I believe, could be used to similar purposes by the good guys, re-forged or not.

(Forgive me if I am stating something really obvious: all of my books are currently sitting in my dorm room, under the careless eye of my careless roommate.)

Hail and Well Met, Lush.

* bows a greeting *

Indeed, Narsil even in its broken form wields great power, especially made manifest in the hands of its rightful heir.

You name the power of the Nazgûl as terror. I would name the power of Narsil as hope. For the same shards that witness to the truth of past evil defeated, carry the promise that evil can be defeated again.

The shards of the Blade that was Broken further testify to the faith of he who dares wield them, he who strides the path of adversity towards healing and restoration. Carrying the shards of Narsil is a visible sign of Aragorn's pledge, strength of commitment, and determination to not give up on what so many others might deem useless.

Aragorn clearly demonstrates the manner in which he has chosen to handle his royal birthright and authority as Isildur's heir. Rather than being Ringbearer of the One Ring which once passed to Isildur, Aragorn bears the weapon of Isildur that has stood against, and continues to stand, against the Ring.

Gandalf the Grey

[ September 08, 2002: Message edited by: Gandalf_theGrey ]

Why didn't Aragorn use a more serviceable blade on Weathertop? You are forgetting the prophecy that no Man could defeat the Witch-King, and Aragorn is obviously a Man.

Although it doesn't say so in the books, I imagine Aragorn knew of the Witch King's prophecy. And since he was a man, sword whole or broken would have done no good. Also, was the Witch King actually at Weathertop (I can't remember)? But what Aragorn knew and Glorfindel at the Ford was that the Ringwraiths feared fire. And that is what he used at both places.

So even Aragorn admits that Narsil is not much use in the shape that it's in. And despite its origins and history, a foot-long stump of a blade isn't going to do anyone much good.

I can only speculate that Aragorn was not carrying around this sword for most of his time of journeying. It probably remained safe at Rivendell. I suppose that Gandalf asked him to carry it as a sort of "calling card" to show Frodo. After all, a warrior carrying nothing but a broken sword would be a pretty good marker. Still, you would think he might have been carrying some other form of weapon, though Tolkien doesn't refer to it.

I noticed that P.J. avoided this whole conundrum by elimnating any reference to the sword until they got to Rivendell.

I have always wondered about this too. IMO Aragorn normally carried a serviceable sword and had Narsil with him on this occasion for some special purpose, possibly related to the mysterious journey that prevented Gandalf from getting in touch with Aragorn when he got the 'bad news' that sent him to Isengard.

He must have used some other sword during his service in Gondor, and probably in his other errantries as well. And had other weapons with him when he encountered the Hobbits, a bow and long knife at the very least.

This is a topic about which I've wondered, myself. I can't believe a warrior like Aragorn went around Ranger-ing for sixty years without a sword or some kind of weapon (no axe is mentioned at all). I DEFINITELY can't see him using Narsil in its broken form over that time, though I guess if you were desperate and had nothing else to fight with at a certain time, well, it would be as nasty as a broken bottle, wouldn't it? : - ) You CAN carry two swords, especially if one is shorter than the other - the samurai did it. It depends where you stash them. Or there's Florentine fighting (sword and knife together... can't you just GUESS I've been in the SCA, though a long time ago, so if we have any current SCAers feel free to correct me on this). So why not carry a serviceable blade without a name or magical qualities, but which is just bloody good at cutting, to paraphrase Terry Pratchett, with Narsil in the knife spot? [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

We should add that for most of his life the *last* thing Aragorn has wanted has been to be recognized as the Heir of Isildur - especially by the Enemy. So all else aside it wouldn't make a lot of sense for him to make a regular practice of carrying an extremely distinctive broken sword around with him.

I stick to my original hyposthesis, Aragorn has Narsil with him for some special reason not directly connected with the Hobbits or the Ring. The obvious suggestion is he used it to identify himself to somebody or something who presumably owes one to the Isildur's Heir. *Not* I think to Frodo since Gandalf's letter makes no mention of a broken sword - just Aragorn's real name - and so Narsil wouldn't mean anything to the Ringbearer.

I agree with those who believe that Aragorn wasn't carrying the broken sword with him all the time - it would be quite useless as a weapon, but probably too precious to loose by acident.
I suppose after Elrond gave the heirlooms of his house to Aragorn, the sword was kept somewhere in the land of his people /as it is said that Elrond kept only the Sceptre in Rivendell/. And when time came Aragorn carried the shards back to Rivendell to be re-forged.

Now that's a good suggestion!

Aragorn has Narsil with him because his 'journey of his own' was to wherever the Chiefs of the Rangers call home to get the shards of Narsil and take them to Rivendell because his foresight tells him the time for its reforging is near at hand.

He is on his way back when word reaches him that Gandalf has disappeared and he starts searching for the Hobbits.

Yes, I like that. Good thinking!

When Strider set out to look for and to help Frodo, did he know he might have to face the Nazgul?

If he did, he would have known that no ordinary weapon would be of any use against them but the sword that had destroyed their Master at the end of the Second Age might make them pause and buy time for an escape. It would be worth risking such a precious heirloom to get the Ring safely to Rivendell.


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If Aragorn had carried the sword to Gondor, it most definitely have been recognized, and Denethor would have had proof to back up his suspicions. Also, if Aragorn had carried the sword while fighting the servants of Sauron, word would eventually have gotten back to Sauron. But, Sauron only knew that the Heir of Isildur lived when Aragorn revealed himself in the palantir at Helm's Deep.
Morwen's theory that Aragorn was carrying the shards of Narsil for a special purpose seems like a good one. But why would Aragorn leave his other sword at home? It can't be so hard to carry two swords that he would risk his life on it. Swords were the mainstay of the Dunedain. He could have worn the Shards of Narsil on his other hip. I suppose the only explanation is that Aragorn was a good enough warrior to not need a sword.

Though Aragorn was an excellant fighter, he needed some type of weapon with him. Even though the broken sword was more of a calling card, or more like a good guy flashing the really big gun, Aragorn would have an assortment of weapons. Probably a sword, a knife, and bow and arrow, and possibly some kind of hidden weapon. I personally think Gandalf had already told him a long time before the hobbits set out to patrol the Shire. On the far side of the Shire, he was sidetracked, and Gandalf couldn't get a hold of him. He may not have had the broken sword with him while circleing the Shire, but he had it in a safe spot. But that's just my theory.

Well, having been redirected to this thread, I'll just go ahead and post my original thread that I posted.

One of the flaws that people have brought up in the comparison between the movie and book is that Aragorn carried one sword of his own BEFORE accepting the Shards of Narsil. In the book, he carried only the shards. I have been a defender of this move, as it made sense for the Ranger in Aragorn (still wandering in the wild) to have a real sword for defense, etc., instead of a broken hilt. (That, and it gave us another beautiful sword to look at!)

But why DID Aragorn carry around just the shards? Where were the other bits? Were they arranged perfectly in the sheath? Did he just upend his sheath to dump all the shards out on the Elven smithy's table? Were they in his pocket, and why didn't they cut through? Did the 800-year old heirloom of the house of Elendil spend some time digging in the dirt to make a convenience hole for "Strider"? Why would such an important token be given to Aragorn to cart around the Wilds with, and how did he survive with just a dagger-like blade?