The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum - Ghosts, myths and legends of Middle-earth

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Groin Redbeard

10-28-2008 12:01 PM

Ghosts, myths and legends of Middle-earth

Since Halloween is coming up soon, and since nobody has made a thread like this so far;), I thought that it would be neat to refresh our memories of everything scary that Tolkien imagined.

It can be a true story that Tolkien has mentioned in his books, or just something that really creeped you out. For example, the story about "Mad Baggins.":) From Feanor's Oath to the things that crawl under the earth, everything scary is welcome!;) What scares you in Middle-earth?

Tuor in Gondolin

10-28-2008 12:54 PM

For scary, how about that dirty old Vala Morgoth.

Quote:

Then Morgtoth looking upon her (Luthien's)
beauty conceived in his thought an evil lust, and a design
more dark than any that had yet come into his thought
sine he fled from Valinor.

Lalwendë

10-28-2008 04:20 PM

You should have a look for one of my 'horror' or Gothic threads, I've started a couple - I love all that stuff and Tolkien is great at it! I've found loads of scary things! :cool:

The top all-time scary thing has got to be the Witch-king's line to Eowyn:

Quote:

He will bear thee away to the houses of lamentation, beyond all darkness, where thy flesh shall be devoured, and thy shrivelled mind be left naked to the Lidless Eye

That's just.......horrible!

And this is the second most frightening thing in all of Tolkien:

Quote:

The Men of Darkness built temples, some of great size, usually surrounded by dark trees, often in caverns (natural or delved) in secret valleys of mountain-regions; such as the dreadful halls and passages under the Haunted Mountain beyond the Dark Door (Gate of the Dead) in Dunharrow. The special horror of the closed door before which the skeleton of Baldor was found was probably due to the fact that the door was the entrance to an evil temple hall to which Baldor had come, probably without opposition up to that point. But the door was shut in his face, and enemies that had followed him silently came up and broke his legs and left him to die in the darkness, unable to find any way out.

Vile!

:eek:

Ibrîniðilpathânezel

10-28-2008 05:18 PM

When it comes to horrific, I always think of a passage in "The Siege of Gondor," beginning with the catapult barrage of Minas Tirith:

Quote:

Then among the greater casts there fell another hail, less ruinous but more horrible. All about the streets and lanes behind the Gate it tumbled down, small round shot that did not burn. But when men ran to learn what it might be, they cried aloud or wept. For the enemy was flinging into the City all the heads of those who had fallen fighting at Osgiliath, or on the Rammas, or in the fields. They were grim to look on; for though some were crushed and shapeless, and some had been cruelly hewn, yet many had features that could be told, and it seemed that they had died in pain, and all were branded with the foul token of the Lidless Eye. But marred and dishonoured as they were, it often chanced that a man would see again the face of someone that he had known, who had walked proudly once in arms, or tilled the fields, or ridden in upon a holiday from the green vales in the hills.

In vain men shook their fists at the pitiless foes that swarmed before the Gate. Curses they heeded not, nor understood the tongues of western men, crying with harsh voices like beasts and carrion-birds. But soon there were few left in Minas Tirith who had the heart to stand up and defy the hosts of Mordor. For yet another weapon, swifter than hunger, the Lord of the Dark Tower had: dread and despair.

The Nazgul came again, and as their Dark Lord now grew and put forth his strength, so their voices, which uttered only his will and his malice, were filled with evil and horror. Ever they circled above the City, like vultures that expect their fill of doomed men's flesh. Out of sight and shot they flew, and yet were ever present, and their deadly voices rent the air. More unbearable they became, not less, at each new cry. At length even the stout-hearted would fling themselves to the ground as the hidden menace passed over them, or they would stand, letting their weapons fall nerveless from hands while into their minds a blackness came, and they thought no more of war; but only of hiding and of crawling, and of death.

Eeeeewwwwhhhhh....

Bêthberry

10-28-2008 08:04 PM

Bombadil. Tom Bombadil. :eek:

Estelyn Telcontar

10-29-2008 02:59 AM

There are several poems in "The Adventures of Tom Bombadil" that have scary elements: a troll of whom people are afraid; an island upon which people land, only to find that it is a tortoise' back; the tale of a shadow-bride. However, the creepiest one is "The Mewlips", which I quote here (not quite in its entirety, but extensive passages to show the effect):

Quote:

The shadows where the Mewlips dwell
Are dark and wet as ink,
And slow and softly rings their bell,
As in the slime you sink.

You sink into the slime, who dare
To knock upon their door,
While down the grinning gargoyles stare
And noisome waters pour.
...

Over the Merlock Mountains a long and weary way,
In a mouldy valley where the trees are grey,
By a dark pool's border without wind or tide,
Moonless and sunless, the Mewlips hide.
...

They peep out slyly; through a crack
Their feeling fingers creep,
And when they've finished, in a sack
Your bones they take to keep.

Beyond the Merlock Mountains, a long and lonely road,
Through the spider-shadows and the marsh of Tode,
And through the wood of hanging trees and the gallows-weed,
You go to find the Mewlips - and the Mewlips feed.

I suppose we could speculate on the kind of creature Mewlips could be, but I don't need to know. True horror depends much more upon imagination than on actually seeing something, and the last line creeps me out without any further information!

Lalwendë

10-29-2008 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bêthberry (Post 571336)

Bombadil. Tom Bombadil. :eek:

But Bombadil is cool, he's quite cute and sort of cuddly. I agree his singing is horrific, enough to make the ears bleed, though that's not a lot different to most of the popstars around these days, is it? ;)

He'd probably go down a storm on the X-Factor.

Tuor in Gondolin

10-29-2008 08:02 AM

Gotta admit, those Mewlips can freak you out,
JRRT seems to have a Darth Vader side!

Btw, you want scary, how about being in a
long term relationship with Ioreth! :eek:

Morthoron

10-29-2008 02:25 PM

Legolas and Gimli holding hands in a boat on the way to Valinor.

The horror.

Bêthberry

10-29-2008 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalwendë (Post 571371)

But Bombadil is cool, he's quite cute and sort of cuddly.

Is it possible that parenting young Alfred has got to you? You must be referring to the Bombadil toy the Tolkien children had. :D

Esty, I bow to your argument about the Mewlips in the Bombadil poems. They are as creepy as any boggart (exceptin' Lalwende) or spriggan or malevolent spirit in folklore, if not more so.

Ibrîniðilpathânezel

10-29-2008 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bêthberry (Post 571502)

Esty, I bow to your argument about the Mewlips in the Bombadil poems. They are as creepy as any boggart (exceptin' Lalwende) or spriggan or malevolent spirit in folklore, if not more so.

I agree. I don't know at all where my copy of the book is right now, but I seem to recall that the "authorial conceit" was that Bilbo and/or Frodo wrote the poems in The Adventures of Tom Bombadil -- and if so, one does have to wonder what nightmare was responsible for "The Mewlips."

Groin Redbeard

10-30-2008 05:22 PM

Barrow Wights!:eek: I was reading Mist on the Barrow Downs, very late at night by candle light for extra effect.;) They are probably the closest thing to a ghost in Tolkien's world. I don't think that he gave any special references about spirits of people lingering around in Arda after they died.

Another thing that creeps me out is the part in the Silmarillion where Luthien and Beren guise themselves in the manner of a giant bat and a were wolf (at least I think it was a were wolf).

MatthewM

10-30-2008 11:22 PM

Indeed the scariest part of The Lord of the Rings has to be The Barrow-Downs. Just read that chapter up until Bombadil's rescue and try not to feel cold, abandoned, and just plain scared. Definitely The Barrow-Downs. There are a lot of other scary things, no doubt, such as The Paths of the Dead (the dead followed you for goodness sake) and The Old Forest. Minas Morgul and the lonliness of Shelob's Lair. All scary...but The Barrow-Downs has to take the cake for me.

mark12_30

10-31-2008 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estelyn Telcontar (Post 571356)

However, the creepiest one is "The Mewlips",

Quote:

Their walls are wet, their ceilings drip;
Their feet upon the floor
Go softly with a squish-flap-flip,
As they sidle to the door.

Brrrr!

I'm with Esty on this one.

Maybe the only thing grosser than a Mewlip is a Watcher in the Water.

Unless it be the Dead Marshes. Don't follow the lights!

Squish-flap-flip.

Morthoron

10-31-2008 06:09 PM

1 Attachment(s)

Happy Halloween...

Lindale

10-31-2008 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mark12_30 (Post 571658)

Unless it be the Dead Marshes. Don't follow the lights!

Hey, don't joke about that... I was a kid when I first read that bit, and I got nightmares for two days about corpses in flowing robes in our fishpond. :(

Eönwë

11-01-2008 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibrîniðilpathânezel (Post 571508)

if so, one does have to wonder what nightmare was responsible for "The Mewlips."

They're sort of like the Wights and the Dead Marshes put together, but worse.

I shiver every time I read that Mewlips thing. And you can just hear water dripping, slowly, drop by drop, cold onto bare stone, where nothing can grow.

Elmo	11-02-2008 04:45 PM

If I remember my long lost (stolen) copy of Morgoth's Ring, Elves can come back as a ghost if they refuse the summons of Mandos. I think that was why Sauron was called the Necromancer. These ghost Elves weren't nice I recall.

Lalwendë

11-03-2008 05:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bêthberry (Post 571502)

No, seriously, I think Bombadil is a cute, cuddly character! :D I mean, he's like a big old bear but in yellow boots and a blue coat, and sounds anything but creepy.

I'm creepy though, especially when I get up in a morning. Forget your Mewlips, you really don't want to encounter a grumpy Lalwende first thing in the morning :eek:

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