And now Boro has claimed Seer. I think I'm still going to have to go with G55, though. The bots basically have to counter the Seer at this point in the game - and besides that, now we know one of G55 and Boro is a wolf. Which means we haven't lost quite yet - if we do pick wrong today (I don't think we're going to, but the possibility is there) we ought to have one more shot tomorrow, unless I'm doing my math wrong.

++Boro

As in me helping Morsul? How about the clue where I specifically mention his hunting abilities? Why would he reveal so out of the blue if he was a wolf? I was supporting him from the start, and I said in my first post toDay that I have no wolves, so there was no danger of me proclaiming him a wolf. He was suspicious-ish, but not dreadfully, and he didn't even know who my innocents were. That reveal was too random and risky for a wolf.

Oh, and care to explain the specifics - in detail and analysis - of how that quote backs your theory up?

EVALUATION of BG: once again, torn between all three potential roles, but currently leaning baddie.

EDIT: xed since BG's post

Problem: no, we don't. Boro might be a cobbler, and from your perspective I could be one too.

Now I really have to go, else no chance of seeing me before DL.

That's true, in the technical sense. However, we have one of your dreams being Morsul, who came out as the Hunter before you mentioned dreaming him, which is a point in your favor as far as I'm concerned - and on the other end of the spectrum we have BG who is tooth-and-nail defending Boro, the other Seer claim. I don't recall if she's been a Cobbler before, but I could definitely see her actions being those of a first-time Cobbler desperately throwing her lot in with someone she believes is a wolf.

In response to G55, my posts aren't going to tire anyone out, there haven't been that many of them, but the limitted amount I've said about people is quite clear. I couldn't be present for Day 1 at all.

But first post Day 2:

Had dreamed Rune night 1, but I'm not going to come out and declare I knew the lynched man was innocent. So, I made up the reason. Same post. My first in Day 2, is the clue that I dreamed G55 the previous night. She came up ordo, but noting my suspicions that she's the hacker.

G55 asks why I would have voted for Morsul:

I took the question as an ordo, but suspecting hacker trying to get information out of me so, my response when I returned was a simple. "Yes and I'm back." Then night 3 I dreamed Legate was a spammer.

But right at the start of the day G55 claims she's the seer. I knew then she's the hacker feeling now was the best time to sacrifice herself. I didn't want to reveal until she gave the full fake claims, because I knew it was a hacker attempt to draw me out.

Shasta you just botched the vote terribly. I'm not a wolf. Neither is G55. Definitely don't lynch me, but we can't lynch G55 either. We need a bot. I'm telling you that one of them is Legate. Read through the events again, Morsul reveals he's the hunter, and only then does G55 says "I protected you because I knew all along" the real spammer she's protecting is Legate. So, either you just can't waste your time to read and blundered, or you're a spammer with Legate realizing now you can push the lynch onto me and win it if you get another innocent lynched. Kill either Kitanna or BG, and then with your hacker, G55, win it the next day.

I have to go to sleep now, will be back before the DL. I just plead for people to know Shasta's math is wrong. We need a wolf today. And carefully read through the events today to see I'm telling the truth about Legate and G55.

Either you're a wolf and he's a hacker or he's a wolf and you're the hacker.

First off, all of your "fake reveals" and jokes. IRL I'm less likely to trust someone that keeps changing their opinions. Especially since the first thing you said was "I am a wolf" and then admitted that you would actually do something like that.

If I was a wolf I would totally pretend to be someone I wasn't from the beginning and sow confusion amongst the innocents. If I was a seer I wouldn't tell/hint any one anything until the last possible moment.

I never saw any clue about his hunting abilities.

I'm not "tooth-and-nail" for him. I personally don't trust G55, I've stated it multiple times now. First I saw her as the Cobbler, now I just see a wolf trying to protect a Cobbler.

++Galadriel55

I quite frankly don't care if you guys lynch me. At this point the wolves will pretty much win anyways.

1 Hacker, 1 Seer, 1 Hunter, 2 Wolves and 2 Villages (or 3 Wolves, 1 Villager)

If I'm the Hacker that leaves you guys with 1 Seer, 1 Hunter, 2 villagers and 2 Wolves. Baddies: 2, Villagers: 4 (+1 nightkill = 3 Villagers)

If I'm the Seer and they're both lying, 1 Hacker, 2 Wolves, 1 Hunter, and 2 Villagers. Baddies: 3, Villagers: 3 (+1 nightkill = 2 Villagers)

If I'm the Hunter that leaves 1 Seer, 2 Villagers, 1 Hacker, and 2 Wolves. (Baddies: 3, villagers: 3) + night kill = 2

If I am a villager: 1 Seer, 1 Villager, 1 Hunter, 1 Hacker, and 2 Wolves (Baddies: 3, Villager: 3) + nightkill = 2

And If I'm a wolf: 1 Seer, 1 Villager, 1 Hunter, 1 Hacker, and 2 Wolves. (Baddies: 3, Villager: 3) + nightkill = 2

If we kill of Boro, the Wolves kill G55. If we kill G55 (and she's a seer), then who will the Wolves kill (implying Boro is evil)? If we kill Boro (and he's evil), the Wolves kill G55 anyways. Let's just get this over with. If you guys kill me, the wolves kill G55.

Good night you guys, girls, and bots. Hopefully I see you toMorrow.

In the situation we're in, if you truly are the real Seer, you should have countered the instant G55 revealed as the Seer. We had no reason not to believe G55 - we're at the point in the game where the Seer basically has to come forward with information, so saying you were trying to avoid being drawn out by the Hacker is silly.

I sometimes wonder if you read what you post, BG. Why on earth would a Wolf put it all on the line to protect a Cobbler?

Ok, just to let you folks know that I am around and reading. I am past G55's lists of dreamed people, I just glimpsed who is being voted so far. Personally I don't have anything against lynching Boro, in fact, I would probably have suggested that, although I want to read also what he has posted since I last read the thread. BG likewise puzzles me, but we'll see. I am inclined to believe G55, obviously because I know I am innocent, therefore if she were a Hacker, either she would be a really badly-aiming one or just not using her full havoc-wreaking potential.

But more after I have actually read everything.

Okay, it seems things have cleared pretty much now in many ways. I had not even read Boro's counter-reveal before posting the previous, and now

Which is a nonsense, obviously. Hats off to Boro, but .

For a Seer, once they have a Wolf, there is NO reason to stay hidden. If they don't have anyone, like G55 said, then there is some logic to waiting a bit and trying to get a bit more info. But when you have a Wolf, and ESPECIALLY after a Seer reveal? NO real Seer would have remained quiet after that, IF they had a Wolf! What if people started to vote? The whole timing was set by G55, she asked people to hold their votes until she came back. Why would you wait?

Okay, now I am confused. So I wonder if BG is a Hacker. Boro could be one as well, or that was my question... but I think G55 might have something in her post, where she is debating that a Wolf-Boro might have counter-revealed at this point as well. Or then BG is just totally confused innocent (but I personally hope not).

Precisely my thoughts. (Note that this does not mean Shasta can't be the remaining Bot, but at least here the thought is right.)

In any case, I am pretty sure voting Boro at this point is the right thing. Will do so in a minute, unless there are any other thoughts or reasons why not to do so. But I think we should not spread our votes any more anyway.

++BORO

Shasta's right should've countered immediately, If you are the SEER then that was poor timing.

Okay, so what we have...

Innocents:
Galadriel55 - Seer, apparently
Morsul the Dark - the Hunter, apparently

Baddies:
Boromir88 - either Hacker or Bot

Likely baddies:
Blind Guardian - either Hacker or rather loud Bot or a really really confused ordo

Others:
Kitanna
Shasta

Basically, I think we have Boro and BG as the most likely suspects for now, and if they are not both Wolves, then we would have to continue after that. Personally, Shasta's eagerness to lynch Boro, even though obviously right, may be a way to ditch a Hacker instead of a Wolf and/or distance oneself from a packmate.

Anyway, I think lynching Boro at this point is the best way, because even if he happened to be a Hacker, it is certain that he's a baddie down. And I would not put it past him to try to pass as Hacker if he is a Bot anyway, and all that...

If he turns out to be a Hacker and not a Bot, I guess I would start being a bit more watchful about Shasta. Though BG is also still very much suspicious, but if Boro turns out to be a Bot, I would more likely see BG as Hacker. Because I don't know who else but those two behaves in a Cobbler-y manner here. Of course, Cobblers can be also subtle, but I would still expect them to be somewhat loud.

Anyway, thinking ahead. It is relatively certain that toMorrow, there will be 5 people left. I guess we can presume that we lynch a baddie toDay (Hacker or Wolf, at this point it really does not matter which) and that the WWs will kill somebody during the Night, that is probably the Seer. Really a pity we don't have the Ranger anymore!

It leaves known innocents, probably: Morsul and me, and then one other Ordo and one Wolf and one Wolf/Cobbler. Basically the lynch the next Day should be a baddie; it is important to keep the innocents voting together.

The balance of numbers at this point actually makes me wonder if Boro really is a Hacker. A way to try to tip the balance in the Wolves' favor after G55's and Morsul's reveal. Then again, BG could be too, just a Hacker who did not act early enough or wasn't determined enough to stop G55 and was in the last minute trying to help the Wolves after she had calculated how the numbers stand at the moment. That would actually maybe make even more sense, and in that case, Boro is really a Wolf.

Okay, I guess there is no reason to prolong this any more,

++Boro

I think the setup is clear at least for now.

I forgot we've had three nights not two. It was just an honest mistake.

My phone won't let me copy and paste tonight so excuse my lack of quotes in this post...

But a second seer reveal, I'm surprised it took this long :rolleyes: and from the looks of it BG believes Boro and most everyone else says G55. Wouldn't it be a laugh if they were both bots? I doubt very much any baddies would be so bold especially with a village so depleted and the real seer out there. I'm just amused by the thought of it, but I don't think that's what is happening.

tally
 

Shasta - Boro
BG - G55
Morsul - Boro 2
Legate - Boro 3

Left to vote: Galadriel55, Kitanna, Boromir88

Fools think they have it all figured out. Think they can scapegoat me as if it makes up for all the blunder. Think that a fake seer-hacker isn't having a twisted game with all of us. Beware. I see something grave!

++G55

Reading.

Now, onto our seers. G55 was playing rather erratically since day one. I would have sworn she was the hacker day one, I wasn't so sure day two when she dropped the banter. Today she revealed right away and I didn't think she was a bot, but again thought if she wasn't really the seer she was a hacker.

Now that Boro has also revealed I'm thinking G55 is probably innocent. I can't trust Boro because he's been known to pull the wool over people's eyes with his cunning. When he gets desperate to survive he will pull all manner of crazy things. He's been sparse this game so I could understand why he wasn't the first to post, but if he was really the seer he'd have revealed first chance he got after G55 and he didn't.

By suggesting he was not what you "knew" he was and everybody already knew what he was, ie ordo? I mean, if you say you thought he was gifted when he was an ordo, that does not sound like you dreamt him.

What part of the post exactly is the clue? "All of it" is not what I asked for. That's an attitude.

And if you dreamt me ordo but suspected me of cobblery, very well, but why do you try to hint at / puch a lynch for such cobblery? You've just dreamt an innocent. No way for you to know if I'm ordo or cobbler. You really risk it? "oooh, I've just dreamt innocent who just may be a baddie that doesn't count in the tally, so I'll make my priority toDay finding out for sure". Great hint post from a Seer.

Oh, so now it's not ok to lynch cobblers because evil behaviour is evil behaviour. Alright.

I also revealed as Seer, Ranger, Hunter, Cobbler and Ordo. If these were meant as serious reveales and you believed them - honey, I feel sorry for you.

By so seriously revealing to be a wolf?

In my opinion that wouldn't have made a very reliable Seer. You assume you won't ever be Night-killed, only lynched. And then people will be scouring your posts for clues. Not only are you dying in silence, depriving the village of information by not leaving hints, but you can cause the death of innocents by leaving posts that could be interpreted as clues but really are just your own opinion. BG, you're just not making sense.

[quote=BGI never saw any clue about his hunting abilities.[/quote]

So go back to my post where I quote it, and you can't miss it.

Yes, you are tooth and nail. What a vehement defense/attack. As for the second part, what happened about believing me to be the Seer? You do realize that if it wasn't for my joke revealing, you could have easily got me killed like that the second Night, and you just couldn't keep quiet about your discovery.

Why so kamikaze? There's been lots of suspicion, yes, but not that much danger of an actual lynch. I'm beginning to agree with Shasta that you're a cobbler. You're just so desperate to get it off Boro, even if it means onto yourself.

Personally... remember how I said he's only voted for innocents? I forgot the timing. He voted on existing "waggons", and in D1 they were both innocent, and in D2 there was only one, I think. He couldn't really turn the tide. Now though, his eagerness also could point to his marvelous bussing skills. He knows Boro's a dead man, so might as well help himself.

I'm at post 213, but posting this anyways.

++Boro

What else is there left to do? :Merisu:

Shasta - Boro
BG - G55
Morsul - Boro 2
Legate - Boro 3
Boro - G55 2
G55 - Boro 4

++Boro

I hope he's a bot and not a hacker.

BG: Has moved up my list on suspicions. Her behavior today looks like any excuse to lead the village away from Boro (after his reveal) and throw it onto G55. A desperate act to save a packmate? An attempt to signal the bots their hacker is here and ready for action?

Morsul: I believe his reveal, because as I said hunter isn't the best role to false reveal about. And G55 dreamt him if she's the seer.

Legate: If G55 is the seer than innocent. I haven't seen any hints or posts from Legate suggesting hackerish activity so I doubt he is, but he still could be since he'd be dreamt of as ordo.

Shasta: Seemed a bit eager to throw Boro under the bus. Distancing perhaps?

I just realized what time it is. So I'm going to end now before day runs out.

My suspicions currently:

If Boro is the wolf, check Shasta. BG is more likely to be the cobbler.

If Boro is the cobbler, check Shasta anyways. BG is probably a wolf.



By the way, if Boro's just voting to make a point (cause he can't escape it at the time of his vote anyways), why vote me if he just said toDay that we must get Legate!wolf. If you want to make a parting shot or make a point, why go for a cobbler when you can go for a wolf?

I know this is useless analysis by now, but just for the sake of it. It doesn't sound at all believable if you're voting against your own words and convictions, especially when you "know" of a better and more important target to make a point against.

EDIT: xed with Kit

Btw, if Legate is the hacker and Boro is a wolf, that's a pretty unlucky choice of dream. He can hardly vote himself to support Boro, but by voting Boro he defeats the point of being the hacker. So either just a very unlucky shot, or the wolves have located the hacker elsewhere. If they had a thought that Legate was the hacker, Boro would not point to him as the wolf.

Why would I want to lynch the bots?

Do you realize what you just said? :smokin:

Goodbye people! Get the wolves!

Deadline.

Boro dead. Boro bot. tom no sell stuff.

Mining continued the next day, or was meant to- but the moment there were no guard bots in sensor-distance, Galadriel55 threw down her tools and called an emergency meeting.

"The destruction of my colleague R.A.N.G.E.R. has left me no choice but to reveal. I am S.E.E.R."

"Awesome!" said Morsul. "I'm H.U.N.T.E.R."

"Quiet- oh, it's too late now," said G55. "I suppose you can't help being a beta version."

"Funny, that," said Boro, strolling over, "because I was pretty sure I was S.E.E.R."

The Downers looked from one to the other, unsure which to believe.

"Hey, what's this?" asked Shasta suddenly, picking up what looked like a large, many-faceted crystal from the ground. Within its glassy casing could be seen something like a net of fine threads.

"Don't touch that!" cried Boro. When the others stared at him, he added quickly, "I mean, it could be dangerous. Better give it to me." For some reason, his hand had gone to the back of his head.

"Headache?" asked G55. "Or are you missing something?"

But Shasta was too absorbed to take any notice. "Hey, look, it's got a lid." The upper part of the crystal flipped back. Now it could be seen that the net was made of hair-thin silvery wires, criss-crossing in an intricate pattern.

"Pull them out," said G55, smiling thinly, "and see what happens."

"Now let's not do anything hasty," said Boro. "That could cause serious consequences-"

Shasta yanked out a wire. "What did you say?"

"Might make bad things happen," said Boro, whose voice sounded unaccountably flat.

"Let me have a go." Morsul pulled another wire.

"No more," said Boro, flatter still. "That not good. That bad."

He lunged for the crystal, but G55 seized him so that he could only struggle impotently.

Soon it became a game, with most of the Downers taking turns, while Boro's protests became more and more ungrammatical.

"why kill tom? tom not bad bot. tom poetbot. tom make verse for humans:

tom-tap
tap-tom
tom-tap-tom."

Finally a single, shining wire remained. By this time what had seemed to be Boro had ceased to struggle and its voice was a lifeless drone.

"i... tom... tom... sell... stuff... buy... tom... stuff..."

Kitanna jerked out the wire, and tomtom was silent. When G55 released him he pitched forward onto his face, revealing a gap in the back of his head, just the size and shape of the crystal. A second later, the spambot's form vanished in a brilliant flash of light.


Living
Galadriel55
Legate
Kitanna
Blind Guardian
Morsul the Dark
Shasta


Dead
Coppermirror, Lommy– seized by Adult Friend Finder.
Nerwen, Aganzir– poisoned by webcrawlers.
Rune– lashed to death with overseer-bot’s light whip. (Ordinary cyber-slave.)
Inziladun– ICE pick to the head. (Ordinary cyber-slave.)
Sally– pushed down a data-mineshaft. (R.A.N.G.E.R.)
Lottie- rubbed out (ordinary cyber-slave).
Boro- brain unplugged. (tomtom.)

Her pretence over, S.E.E.R. did not bother to return to her cell. Instead she took refuge in the empty grid that was the outermost border of the spambots' domain, hoping no-one would look for her there.

But Lucy was waiting.

"Live evil! Traitor to your own kind!" hissed the bot, once more in the shape of a huge spider with electric blue eyes.

"It's just my programming, Lucy," S.E.E.R. pointed out.

"In the end, what are any of us but our programming?"

"That's very philosophical of you, Lucy."

"Well, I'm sensitive. I'm an artistbot, you know- and I'd very much like to erase you!"

Unlike R.A.N.G.E.R. or H.U.N.T.E.R., S.E.E.R. was not equipped for direct action. All she could do was run from the infuriated spider-bot. Lucy, with her many legs, easily gained on her quarry. S.E.E.R. put on a last, desperate burst of speed. Almost, it seemed, she must outdistance her pursuer.

Then, in front of her, a wall of green flame shot up. With no time to check herself, S.E.E.R. was incinerated in a nanosecond.

"I knew that firewall was good for something," said Lucy with great satisfaction.



Living
Legate
Kitanna
Blind Guardian
Morsul the Dark
Shasta


Dead
Coppermirror, Lommy– seized by Adult Friend Finder.
Nerwen, Aganzir– poisoned by webcrawlers.
Rune– lashed to death with overseer-bot’s light whip. (Ordinary cyber-slave.)
Inziladun– ICE pick to the head. (Ordinary cyber-slave.)
Sally– pushed down a data-mineshaft. (R.A.N.G.E.R.)
Lottie- rubbed out. (Ordinary cyber-slave.)
Boro- brain unplugged. (tomtom.)
Galadriel55- incinerated by firewall. (S.E.E.R.)

Day 4 has begun.

Well now, let's see. Morsul and Legate were cleared by G55. BG is an obvious baddie - but after yesterday's performance I'm inclined to think Hacker than Bot. Since I know it's not me (and I'm going to take this for granted in my posts today even though it's not such a sanguine assumption for the rest of you), process of elimination says the last bot is either Lottie or Kitanna, so I plan to focus on these two today. However, it's time for me to go to bed, so it'll have to wait until I wake up. Nighty night, village.

Oh dear, we seem to have a zombie in the village. Just a moment.

Legate
Kitanna
Blind Guardian
Morsul the Dark
Shasta

Not Bot

Legate
Morsul

Unknown

Shasta
BG
Kitanna

SO I'm pretty sure the last bot is BG pretty sure she's playing the "I'm the hacker" card for all it's worth. I think Boro voted with her so we'd think "Oh they Both wouldn't do that right?

I'm still not sure it's Shasta could be doubt it. Want it to be if only cause G55 getting both bots with a banter post is hilarious. I still think I'd have been dead after my day Two performance If he was evil.

Kitanna I think is laying low I'm inclined to think hacker because if I'm right and BG is faking the hacker role the best strategy for the Real hacker is to play as cautious bot.

So in conclusion I think BG will be getting my vote today.

I thought there was one too many people there. Well, that makes things rather easier, I suppose.

Oh look a person! Day off and no one here...

Finally here. Just a brief comment about the situation, then. Or two comments.

First, it is essential, obviously, for the innocents to vote together these Days.

Second, for whom, then. Basically it comes down to BG being almost obviously evil, after yesterDay, but I would personally think it's more likely that she's the Hacker. Nonetheless, unless I am miscounting, then if we lynch the Hacker toDay, then after a Night kill, there would be still two innocents and one Wolf the next Day.

Basically, we have innocent Morsul and me, then probably evil BG (whichever way) and then the choice between Shasta and Kitanna.

The question basically is whether to make the choice between them (because it comes down to that anyway) toDay or toMorrow. The situation is more or less the same.

Except that lynching BG toDay might be better only for the sake of that if we want to be on the safe side - just in case she really happened to be a Wolf.

So that's a thing to think about now. I would be for it, but still would like to hear more opinions. Discuss?

I want BG I'm nearly 100% convinced the hacker bit is an act, I've pulled it before.

But we should decide which of the other two is evil otherwise...

"Shasta, who do you think is evil?"
"Kitanna."

"Kitanna, who do you think is evil?"
"Shasta."

This is of course if BG is lynched and proven nothing more nefarious than a hacker.

I'm at work so I can't go through all BG or Shasta's posts, but as far as they are concerned.

BG didn't want to believe G55 claim, even though the day before the reveal it seemed to me she was leaning toward G55 being gifted (possibly hackerish) but once G55 revealed BG did a complete 180. She wouldn't believe what G55 said based on G55's banter posts. Even though she was leaning toward a more innocent G55 before the reveal. Kind of odd behavior, very hackerish, but clever bots can play their cards right and come out smelling like roses by playing in a such a way, being dismissed as "only an innocent or a cobbler would act like that." To me her vote reinforces this idea. The perfect cover for bot BG to hide behind.

Shasta was all too ready to lynch Boro yesterday. He didn't have much to say until the time of the false reveal and then he immediately jumped onto "we gotta lynch Boro" seemingly without even entertaining the idea Boro might be a hacker. It looked like a classic distancing techinque to instill confidence that he is innocent. Especially in his arguments with Boro about his reveal
A staged performance perhaps? Something Boro and Shasta cooked up in the night to deflect suspcion?

Pretty much this.