I'm going to try and read, in a row, posts by individuals who have made a significant contribution thus far. I don't know if it'll help, but we'll see...

It will be interesting to see what will count as "significant contribution"...

Right, I'm off now so let's try this new-fangled voting.

++Lommy for Rep

She strikes me as pretty trustworthy at the moment and I also think she'll hold to her own opinion even if the other Reps are pretty strongwilled, and on Day 1 I think that's good.

Quickly- people have mentioned voting for submarines and forcing them to stand up. I'm not sure where I stand on that. I agree with the principle that villagers should be forced to give opinions, but I'm not sure I like the idea of giving power to unknowns.

What if we decide to vote for Rune and then he comes in and says, "Yay! I'm a rep! I say we kill ++Nog!" It would leave me feeling extremely foolish.

I disagree, not in the way that it's wrong, but I would like to see that someone is not considered a viable lynch by the other representatives, solely for that fact that said person is a representative. Because, I would bet at least once in this village, wolves would elect one of their mates as a rep.

I think we're un-needlessly complicating the "Who I want as a rep" situation. I don't like the idea of putting a suspected/possible wolf as a rep, for the purpose of getting a concrete vote out of them. Nogrod, if you're not a wolf, I know you won't let the quiet ones slip unnoticed, and if you are a wolf, you still won't let the quiet ones slip unnoticed.

What's the reward here? I want someone who I trust is innocent, as well as someone who will represent my voice. That simple. We have an advantage in numbers, and the advantage of not allowing the wolves get control of who gets lynched. Yes, ordo's will make mistakes, but at least I know they mean for the best. Because the fact is, as hard as we could try to not get a wolf in as a rep, it's going to happen, period. That doesn't mean we should help them out and hand them the reigns.

Do you mean if you were to cast me as a rep? Oh the power of having the phantom's endorsement would be overwelming.

Ok, but seriously now, I think I said before whether I have any voting power the next 24 hours or not, I'm still going to be active and lobbying. That's not going to change. Or if you want to put it this way, I aint gonna shut up.

That's enough for me about the dynamics of representatives, when I return from dinner I will log my thoughts and make a decision on my rep.

Wow, Kath, that came rather unexpectedly. :D Thank you, I guess. I'm not sure I'd be über-glad to be a rep, though - I have very little idea about who's a wolf. Well, there's plenty of time still...

For sure. But I think in his case it's just that he hasn't realised this game has started, or something, so I'd hesitate to use him as an example... but the general point kind of makes sense. Although, whatever he'd say would give a better picture of him than nothing, if you know what I mean.


edit: xed with Boro

I'm tempted to make Ilya our second representative right now with a second vote. I think she might be one we should see there. I mean even if she is an old sport around here she's quite unknown to us later-comers in here and I really would like to see what she does - and looking at her last post just made me a bit more confident about her. So she might be something like a compromise to me: someone whom I could trust a bit to be having the good of the village in her eyes and someone I might learn more of (to trust her later or not) were she chosen as a representative.

I think I will go for exploration of unknown territories toDay. It may / will be different later in the game. Then we really have to think about whom we trust and not so much whom we'd like to see there to learn.

But you who stay up later to the game should really look for us having a fair amount of representatives and no-one of them having like 10 votes... That's too risky at this point of the game.

---

I see Kath has voted. A good point indeed (and I do share her feeling about Lommy, at least for now) which I might follow if I would suddenly be tempted not to wish to have a look at Ilya making it as a representative which I think might be both a "securish" as the feeling goes and also a learning experience for the Days to come - to whomever they come.

I see your point tp and I do appreciate it. But as I said it's Day1 and we have a rare occasion to test people's reactions in this kind of game - for good or bad. I mean we all can post on the next 24-hours and make our points heard. So then someone going rampant would have to face the consequences, right?

Gah, I need to decide and soon as it's approaching 1AM here...

My read-throughs thus far-

Shasta- Despite his high number of posts, I am not able to form an opinion on him. I'd like to see a few more serious opinions from him.
Boromir- I have not received a full read on him yet, but his vibes thus far have been innocent.

Here and reading. Will post momentarily. Hi everyone. :)

Correction, I've made three posts. Though, as if it makes a difference...;)

*shrug* If you want to vote this way, that's cool.

Sorry for the indifference, I'm hung up over whom I want to vote for now. Ilya is certainly appealing for pervious reasons I've mentioned already (repeating is annoying, frankly), but so are a few others.

Plus, a little bit of difference on the take of things between base and representative would more than likely force others and I to have an opinion. Especially if said representative acted in a way that I dissagreed with.
I'm liking the idea of a healthy dose of friction as a self-help. It might seem a gamble, but I guess that's what I get for working at a casino.

++Boro88 for Representative

I've always liked Boro88's level of common sense, even if it's not exactly how I or whom I trust as innocent see the situation. Plus, I agree with his point of action on that representatives are not going to morph into something completely different just because they have their own playing field later on.

Habits taken in, I'm horribly notorious for being an observer and probably too cautious. It definately works some of the time, but I like the idea of my representative taking a risk, and thus making myself more involved and opiniated. I'm not definate of anyone's real role just yet, but I know if something bothers me enough I form more of an action and want to help problem-solve.


Okay, I have to leave for work and bring food to poker players. Later.

~ Ka

Notable occurrences:

Agan and Greenie making Brinniel a representative. I was actually leaning towards voting for her myself, but now it seems my vote won't be needed.
Greenie made a list, with which I agree, on some people.

Especially phantom. :p

Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not nearly as anti-Phantom as I usually am, because he's been making good points and asking fair questions. It just annoys me that the discussion becomes so very Phantom-o-centric. There are other issues and other people playing, after all.

There's also been some discussion on "weak" and "strong" reps. I think I am correct (though feel free to correct me) in saying that the Representative's power is based on how many votes he or she received; a Rep with 4 votes will have double the voting power than a Rep with only 2 votes.

Legate also made a list. What's odd is that he seems to be on very good terms with both Boromir and Phantom... a bit flip-floppy on Phantom, actually, based on his earlier attitude. I think Lommy's right about a possible Boro-Phantom-Legate triangle, but to what purpose? Surely they're not all wolves... are they?

I agree with this, actually. In a game of this type, I think it's much more important to not let people slip under the radar. I think I could vote for Nogrod for rep today, but I'll keep looking.

I've noticed a couple of people have been thinking of voting me. Hooray, it makes me feel special. :D I'll use a seperate post as my "campaign" post, so as to not muck this one up.

Who's Immanuel Kent? I feel out of the loop.

Ka is one person I'm getting a weird feeling about. She hasn't said much, but I'd like to look at her later.

McCaber is also slipping nicely under my radar, but that's usual.

I disagree. I don't think quiet players... hmm, I'm not sure how to put this without sounding mean. I'm not sure quiet players will have participated enough to know what is in the best interests of the village. Did that come out alright? I apologize if it didn't.

In other words, you want to be the power behind the throne. :p

I'm fine with being made a Rep. I'm gonna be here for the deadline, and I promise, I won't arbitrarily vote Phantom (unless warranted :p).

As for opinions, I really don't think quiet, unobtrusive players should get nearly as much leeway as they do in regular games. If you're not talking, you're not participating, and if you're not participating, you're not working for the good of the village.

About ye filibustere-

I think that today, there is really no need for them. They won't actually help anyone (we know nothing) and there's really no point in doing one. However, if someone wants to waste their filibuster today (this early on), eho am I to stop them?

Reading page 4...

I'm just wondering why you tp and Boro are so much against some risks or tests on Day1 in this kind of a game?

I would hate to see a scenario where some of the "generally trusted veterans" would make all the votes when we have this kind of opportunity to try things in the first Days.

Sure you're right (whoever it was to point it out) that we should be careful not to vote for any clear clicks as our representatives - like even if I feel pretty good about Greenie at the moment I wouldn't like her to be a representative for us just because Brinn already is.

And a Day or two later - God willing - I will cling to those I really trust as the stakes will be higher and the chances for curiosity and risk-taking becomes more dangerous.

Agreed to the fullest... Although we have some others who have done even worse, like Eonwë and McCaber who have posted a few more times than those who have not posted anything or just one or two posts (which I think is bad playing - timezones and RL issues to be taken in as factors to be sure), and still there is no actual input in there. The downside to this is of course that at least some of them tend to do that as an ordo as well and so it's not so much a case against them but more like a stance on how this game should be played.

Hush! Talking about the most famous barber-shop talk-about from the age of our forefathers, Immanuel of Kent that is (you never took a serious look of those minor characters in the Shakespeare plays on the War of the Roses? :D), might cause a modfire...


Okay. I really seem to be cross posting with too much...

Have I really not been being clear? :( I've been trying, I swear...

My read-through is being interrupted by something. That something is that I'm at work and must occasionally keep children from killing each other. :rolleyes:

But I've finished Nog at least. So my updated read-through list-

Shasta- Despite his high number of posts, I am not able to form an opinion on him. I'd like to see a few more serious opinions from him. (He seems to be back now, and my opinion of him might change soon.)
Boromir- I have not received a full read on him yet, but his vibes thus far have been innocent.
Nogrod- I find myself suspecting him for no reason whatsoever, but he makes sense and his talk seems to make for a productive and thoughtful atmosphere, and so I am more than willing to push my weak feelings of mistrust aside for now.

Sorry I just got home and was in an all day meeting so I am far too behind to catch up in the next few hours so I will vote for a rep now. As stated earlier I'm going with those who I consider intelligent, I have a history with and who I generally trust...they must meet all 3 requirement. While I normally trust the phantom the vibe I'm getting from him this round is odd, not necessarily bad but enough to eliminate him as a choice...plus I wouldn't want to feed the ego any more. That leaves Boro, Diamond and Nog. I haven't read anything from any of them. Boro has burned my trust in the past, but he's also saved me...Nogrod is intense as is Diamond and all are very thoughtful and analytical.

++Nogrod for rep

Boro already has a vote and I presume will get another. I would be comfortable having both Nog and Boro as reps. Sorry Diamond, I have a longer history with Nog so he won out.

Now off to fill out forms for grad school.

All right. Let's see. Shasta the Returned makes me kind of more doubtful than when I have seen him at the beginning.

As for Mr. P., he is really... eh... racing up on my list. Good reasons to vote him?

A) I don't think he'd be a Wolf.
B) I am quite inclined to trust he would do something in whatever situation: only maybe a bit worried what all possible "somethings" may occur.
C) Voting him as Rep would actually move him to vote, for his own, and not just be the grey eminence. May be helpful.
And at last, D), don't say it won't be really classic to vote him, now that I was the one to shout about it before the game even started...

Oh geez, so many posts. No wonder I always have such trouble keeping up on Day 1. :rolleyes:

When it comes to voting for a rep...

I think I'd like to avoid voting for one of the louder players for toDay. Innocent or not, some of these players talk so much that it becomes easy to overlook the quieter players. Which may be a reason why the louder players often seem to die first and the quiet players don't get noticed until later when you only just realise they're not dead yet. At the same time though, I don't think I'd want to vote someone who's too quiet (as it seems others are contemplating). Because if all the reps were silent players who only made one or two posts, then I don't think very much progress will be made towards lynching a wolf. So perhaps someone in between loud and quiet.

And when it comes to picking a rep, it's obviously gotta be someone whose judgement I trust. Of course I want to vote someone I think is more likely innocent than not, though that may pose difficult at this early stage when I seem to think everyone looks innocent. :rolleyes:

As of now, my top two candidates are Kath and Shasta...two players who make good judgements and whose voices haven't been strongly heard yet (while Shasta's made a high number of posts, I wouldn't consider him a loud player as far as substance goes).

Though I could also consider Aganzir who also makes wise choices, at least when she's innocent. I usually can get a good read off of her though this time not so much since she's only posted twice (what's up with that?). But voting her as rep would be one way to get a better read of her.

I could also consider voting Di, who made such an excellent campaign for herself. ;)

I'm going to eat, but I'll be back soon. Parting thoughts:

1. I'm having a bit of an issue with Legate's voting stance, even though it's been thrashed out on the thread already. There was one post I read that sounded sensible, but then another that made me go "Huh?"

2. I like Boro's voting stance; it's somewhat like my own. When I vote for a Rep, I want it to be someone who thinks similarly to me; the whole point of voting a Representative, after all, is to have your voice heard, so if you vote for a Rep whose thoughts are drastically different from your own, whether or not they seem to be trustworthy... :rolleyes:

I've finished two more, and I'll update Shasta-

Shasta- I like that he is being vocal, but he is much different than the last time I saw him. But if I'm not mistaken he was very busy last time, so that is to be expected. Due to my lack of feeling on him I certainly don't feel like I can trust him, but I'm certainly not feeling like being rid of him. He gives me someone to talk to in the early hours. :D
Boromir- I have not received a full read on him yet, but his vibes thus far have been innocent.
Nogrod- I find myself suspecting him for no reason whatsoever, but he makes sense and his talk seems to make for a productive and thoughtful atmosphere, and so I am more than willing to push my weak feelings of mistrust aside for now.
Lommy- Nothing she's saying is setting off alarms, so I'm fine with her for now.
Legate- I swing back and forth on Legate when I read him. But for now, see my reaction to Nogrod.

Okay, that's all the read-throughs for now. I covered everyone with double-digit posts.

morm feels... busy. I can't read him yet.

All in all... I am in a bit of anti-Nerwen mood (stated above, I am used to her posting, and posting sense: just what was that?), and in a bit of anti-Brinn mood (this "large front of support" simply does not sit well with me, taken that Brinn, from my part, gets no reading) and Shasta-worry mood (somehow, I get the feeling he is very randomly picking things from the thread even though he just skimmed through it - or so is the impression it makes on me). Anyway... should vote for a rep soon... phantom! Answer me. Would you accept, if I give you my vote?

I would certainly do everything possible to bring about a favorable outcome for the village. But of course I would require one additional vote to become a Rep. If you think that I am likely to gain that vote then feel free to go on. But if you don't think it's likely, I would not want you throwing your power away.

I'll have to give Brin and Green a read-through later. If I'm remembering right Brin didn't give me anything yet, and I didn't like Green for some reason. But as I said, I need to dedicate a reading to them. Perhaps in an hour or so.

Yep and Yep.

I thought you wanted some fun.;) Anyway, if I was to take this seriously, I would say that this would be an easy way for you to disguise your views and opinions of people. But I don't:p

I was a bit torn between Ilya and Lommy as my choices but I will be sticking to my curiousity this Day and vote for

++ Ilya

... thus making her a second representative.

I kind of agree with most of her actual points she made in her list (not all).

To be more exact: I agree with her about

- Boro being sensible but being not sure about him. But clearly, lynching him on Day1 would be very bad playing indeed.
- Brinn feeling generally good by a bit too many of us and thence worth suspecting just because of that if not for any other reason (even if my instincts go for saying she's an innocent - but that's what they always seem to be doing - and that's another reason to be uncomfortable with her).
- Greenie looking more innocent than not.
- Lommy feeling genuine... at least this far. With her I know she can totally fool me... Like Greenie can... Too close, too hard to fathom?
- With tp I'm also ready to buy it so far although I'm not feeling too secure with him either. But surely lynching him toDay would be a cardinal mistake. Believe me or not, but if he's a baddie he can be caught at some point - and if his intentions are good he will be an asset to us.

I do somewhat disagree with her about:

- Di whose vote and posts looked like more sincere than not (fex. the wish to be a rep).
- Legate tends to write a lot and so it's no reason to suspect him as such. And his few defences toDay really looked more like an innocent's points.
- Kath I do not trust (she makes it through the first Days too easily as a tactical manouver like this every time) - even if I don't find her especially suspicious either at this point of the game.
- I don't see where the point of McCaber poking at tp was coming from (maybe I just missed a post?) or how would it talk about his innocense or guilt?

Okay... 5-4 with agreeing... not too confident indeed as I now look at it.

But let's see to it.


We can all talk the next 24 hours even if not all of us can vote in the end... and even if tp thinks the representatives being less likely to be lynched (which might be psychologically true looking at the Day where the reps have a kind of talk within themselves), they can be lynched afterwards if they seem to play it foul. So choosing a representative is not giving someone a safety option. On the contrary, I think it can be a challenge - at least to the wolves as they need to actually vote and leave a track.


PS. Eonwë: is that all you can say with four pages of discussion made? (EDIT: actually we're on page five already! ;))

Ok- It's votin' time!
 

Well, this is a very unproductive day.

I'm was thinking of voting Nogrod- he seems very reasonable and is talking a lot of sense (but maybe trying to be too helpful). He would have gotten my vote but for his time constraints. And now it seems if I do vote for him then he becomes a rep. So, I won't force it on him.

Then there is Ilya, but I don't really know her well enough yet, though she seems innocent enough.

Then there's Greenie. I just feel good vibes from her post, and she seems innocent, and also seems to be looking at things similarly to me. But then she voted Brinniel, which I wouldn't do. What the heck...

++A Little Green for Representative

Casinos: the red man's revenge.

Ok, so toDay I am voting

++Nogrod

as my representative. I think he'd do a good job of keeping the quiet players on their toes, making the ranks of the sub-reindeer-sitters a less than safe place for a wolf to hide. This, at any rate, is my hope.

Good. Freaking. Gravy. I'm at work for only a few hours and....wow.

*goes to catch up*



Telling you all now that toDay I'm going to be extremely scarce. So on the off chance someone wanted me to be a rep (not likely, but still) don't do it. I'm going to have enough trouble keeping up as it is, at least tonight.

Hmm... I was taking a look on how this is looking this far... Brinn, that's for granted. Then Nogrod, Boro, Lommy... all I consider innocent-ish, not sure if I'd vote them all, I have perhaps a bit for and perhaps a bit against every one of them... Ilya, I don't know anything about (yet I agree with those who say she seems reasonable), but perhaps she has support from somebody else...

There is still a large bunch of people going to vote, but I wonder if it is good to spread the votes yet, or not... though better if we have five reps than three, if you get my meaning. Being in the position of the "beginner", I may give some good starting position to a person to whom I give one vote...

In either case, I will be careful about giving too much executive power to one person: that means, let's hope all the Wolves are not Americans.

I actually have very good reasons, and would be even in the mood of voting for Nogrod. That would mean easing up things a lot, for certain. Still, if I only knew how others are going to vote... if tp is likely to get at least one vote more, indeed... (or again, if I knew he's going to get fifty votes, I'd also have no problems with choosing).

What about flipping a coin? ;) Last time, it worked... sort of (well, I was picking from two Innocents. Hey, while, this time it would be good :) )

Nay, let me see - if there is any really good time in the game to vote tp, it would be possibly now. Later, if I were unsure, I would pick less... hmm... eccentric people. Now I am only maybe somewhat not entirely sure about where tp's suspicions would be going (says the one who said it does not make any difference... apparently, this game is full of switches on my part). As for what Nog says about people he suspects or not, he actually fits well the patterns of mine: that is, thinking innocent those I think innocent - more or less - and I can go with most of his opinions. But then... just, heck, let us get moving. Nogrod is probable to get a vote anyway, I think - and about the phantom, then I say, let us see. ToMorrow, he, or anybody else, still can be switched - that's the advantage of the democracy.

So:

++The Phantom for Representative

*gasp* I actually did that. Tp, I hope you are going to keep that signature of yours for long. For it proves: "Kdo to říká, ten to je, k tomu se to šikuje" ("Whoever says it, is one who does it, to him all's moving, to him all flocks it"). First to deny it, first to do it.

Goodbye and see you in a short while tomorrow.

EDIT: x-ed since phantom's last one. Okay, I say.

Ilya looks like she'll be around and will give opinions, so I don't mind that selection at all. I hope to get to know her better via her status as Rep.

And I agree with Gwath's nomination. On Day 1 I can hardly expect Nog to pick accurately, but I do expect that he will use good standards for voting.

E-eek.

Just could not resist: Really a bad one from my point of view.

Really? And what would you consider productive (than five pages)? And that says the one who gives two one-liners and then votes.

And this I call kind of an alibism, of sorts. But okay. Well, I am really raising my eyebrows at this post.

And now finally goodnight.

I should probably vote now, just on the off chance that rehearsal runs long. So without further ado...

++ Aganzir for Representative

Shasta, may I ask what's your motive in pointing out a Legate-phantom-Boro triangle? I'll give you the jovialness with the phantom, but I'm not sure how I've been friendly towards Legate; considering I said he rang me suspicious alarm and I have yet to recant that statement.

Either just by random innocencentness or through wolvish intent, a wolf will end up a representative at some time during this game, so why help them out? I like being risky, but it better have a big pay off. I don't see a big reward in handing a suspected wolf a right to vote. As I said, this is our advantage, a chance for wolves not to muddy-up the voting tally, we should use it. If I can help it, I would not like to give the wolves voting power.

On morm...Nothing stands out about a guilt or innocence. He was involved early, talked about devising a plan, which I know morm loves organization, and definitely off-the-wall plans. He was an early possibility as a representative, but now is out of the race, due to his business/lack of time.

On Nogrod...it struck me odd at first why he wants to advocate the less-loud villagers as representatives, considering he usually goes after them. But, now it looks like an attempt to get more involvement out of the quieter ones. I just don't think it's going to work, because I don't think being a rep will change anyone's style. Also, if Nogrod can not be a representative, it could be an attempt to keep the power out of people who could potentially be dangerous for a wolf-Nogrod. What is Nogrod really up to? Care to answer?

I feel good about Ilya, but I'm going to run back over Lommy's post. I have this strange churn in my stomach about her, and maybe that's just because several people feel she's looking innocent.

Hmm. Perhaps it's more of an angle, with Phantom at the center. I just latched on to Lommy's phrase because I saw the same thing she did.

Wolves will lay low, stay out of things to let innocents lynch innocents, or they will attempt to get rep votes by sounding reasonable? Which one is it Lommy?

Latched on to Lommy? Oddly enough that makes me feel you're innocentish.

Well- I... er... wasn't aware that either of them were interested in me. And I can certainly say that my interests lie elsewhere, so the theory is flawed.

I'm holding out for one of our dear Mod-Goddesses. ;)

I never said love-triangle... your dirty mind thought that up all on its own. :p

This post doesn't mean much, I just want the vicarious thrill of posting in the middle of rehearsal, watching The Odd Couple. :D