I use phrases like "I deem" in my everyday life, an dget quite a few odd looks. However, pretty much everyone knows I am a reading maven and a Shakespeare fanatic, so I'm forgiven.

I enjoy reading posts from non-English speakers. The effort they put in is plain, and I appreciate it. I know for a fact that I couldn't write that well in French, my second language.

I suppose I could live with "I suppose", but I'd never have guessed that "I guess" would be deemed to be such a vulgar phrase.

Who'd a thunk?

[ October 17, 2002: Message edited by: Birdland ]

Well, Ah reckons it best to take my talk to PM with you, H-I, 'cause this little ol' Canuck is in danger of getting caught in the crossfire between these Yanks and Brits at the OK Corral. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

"deem" is not archaic in Canada, but formal. Look for the PM later.

Bb

I'm afraid that it's quite beyond the pale in polite society, old thing. In some circles one could be thought simply barbaric for using so presidential an expression. ;)

Don't listen to these transatlantic heathens, H-I: five minutes with them will guarantee that no civilised human being can understand a word you're saying. :p

Promise me you'll teach me everything when I move to London next year, dearest Squatter. After all, I'm just a "lunatic" Dane (your own words about Danes, remember? [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] ) slashing my way through the English grammar.
But I do by far prefer the British spellings and such over the American. No offense meant.

[ October 17, 2002: Message edited by: Maikadilwen ]

I beg to remonstrate with you, Sir Squatter, and disabuse you of the vile notion that all transatlantics speak Sam Slick's dialect.

Lilibet was just here and we practiced for weeks for her. She deems us veddy proper.

*short, sharp curtsy*

Bethberry

Shoot! And I thought if I avoided wearing Burmuda shorts with matching belt and shoes, and the T-shirt with advertising on it, I could "blend."

Oh well, if I'm going to speak like a barbarian, I may as well act like one as well. Where's my bowie knife and raccoon cap? Look out England! I'm crossin' the pond!

[ October 17, 2002: Message edited by: Birdland ]

I don't see whats so wrong about some misspellings? Ok, I'm quite new here, so please don't hate me, and I am truly, deeply, sorry for the 'YO!!!!!!!!!!' post, but it was my first post, so again, I am truly ,deeply etc. sorry. I'll think about my spelling in the future. Even if 'yo' is a word (I think...), atleast it's a word I always use...

But I still don't understand whats so wrong with misspellings, as long as you understand the sentence...

This thread makes me quite confused, (English grammar isn't exactly my best side, and then I'm also only 13...) but I just wanted to apologize for my 'yo'...

[ October 17, 2002: Message edited by: Mlo ]

Child sneaks back to her old posts and carefully replaces every "I guess" with "I suppose" or some such thing.

Hope no one catches me doing this.......

sharon

NN10's hall of shame (or shamnasium, if you please)
-Fangirl topics
-Sam topics
-Elf topics
-any post made by me [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

Hello and greetings Mlo,

No problem with the Yo; it was the exclamation marks which were overdone. They belong in chateze, but not in English.

We're just whining here about people who don't care about language. You'll get used to us! And I'm sure you'll learn to appreciate precise writing! Whatever you do, never use (sp?) in a post or Rimbaud's flying trout will come after you! (That's a reference to the (sp): Phantom Menace thread.)

Enjoy your time being dead here, too. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Bethberry

[ October 17, 2002: Message edited by: Bethberry ]

Why do YOU like legolas?
we now have sunk lower than ever before. i name this, WORST THREAD EVER!!!

And I name you, NN10, as the ultimate topic interrupter. Get back on topic or you'll be off the bridge soon.

Thanks for your cooperation.

(gulp)...YES SIR!!
(salutes and walks away)

*Maril raises hand for Child to pause, before replacing all those 'I guesses.'*

Are we in polite company, Squatter? [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

-Maril

I beg your pardon, but... agony?

You are scaring me... after absences such as I have taken, this very thread seems all too nitpicky. [img]smilies/confused.gif[/img]

Everyone makes spelling errors and grammatical errors. Sometimes the don't realize it. Even if it is bothersome, there are many people here from non-English speaking countries as well as younger members who are still learning. I wouldn't blame any of you for jumping on me after you read this, but being the person that I am, I attempt to be über-tolerant of everything ( which can often be a disadvantage) and don't see reason for such pickiness.

I'm sorry! [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img]

[ October 17, 2002: Message edited by: Ithaeliel ]

Why yes, my good Ithaeliel,

Poor spelling can indeed lead to agony.

* blows about a mischievous smoke ring *

Say for instance, you're surrounded by a pack of Orcs. The only appropriate spell is one you normally don't use, so you've had some young Elvish shieldmaiden named Mary Sue (swooning, no doubt, over Legolas, mind not on her work at any rate) inscribe it on a scroll as a memory aid. Then when the time comes to read it, you find the writer's presentation of words unclear. Incorrect spelling leads to incorrect spelling.

Then I deem, dim dumb damaging doom dominates. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

Gandalf the Grey

I don't really mind misspellings as long as I can understand what they're trying to say. It's just that I can't stand what I call "lazy speech". You know what I mean, replacing 'you' with U, replacing 'anyone' with NEone, and so on. I also hate it when people say things that make no sense if you think about it, double negatives and such.

Gandalf, indubitably. Nev, it's the laziness, exactly.

Ith, I can understand if one comes late to a conversation and one hasn't heard what was said before, about foreign speakers, about utter carelessness vs. the occasional errors we all make... then some repetition may be needed. But here we have the entire conversation. In writing. It's all here. It's good manners when you post in a conversation to read what the others have said before you. It's similar to listening to other people and participating. We've already discussed foreign speakers and occasional misspellings.

But here's a handy synopsis, for those too lazy to read:

• Thread names alone are listed in the 'Hall of Shame' (that was on the first page by-the-way) because they are not the scattered inevitable misspellings, but appear in bold. Every time you look at your own thread, every time you post in it, you have an opportunity to see and correct the error. Most people post often in their own threads. Sheer laziness to not correct it.
• This thread does not pertain to people for whom English is a second language. Foreign speakers tend to be more careful with their writing than most English-speaking natives. Their spelling is often more accurate. They are also fairly easy to spot.
• There has been a valid point raised about the difference between the Linguist's point of view on language, and the English major's point of view. This discussion was swiftly overlooked. Of course Tolkien would attract a majority of the latter.
• There have been a number of people who have apologized for their spelling. I remain confused by this. Why apologize to us? Just doubleback and fix it. Then you can tell us: I'm sorry, you must have misread my thread.
• There are number of people who have defended their poor spelling and grammar. Or have defended the right not to be criticized for it. Does this make their spelling correct? If it does not matter, why is there a standard? Why are there dictionaries? Why is it that an essay gets a big red circle around a misspelling, and resumes with such errors get tossed in the trash without further ado? The standard is real, it's out there, and people are critiquing your spelling whether you hear about it or not. Why use a message board to ingrain a bad habit? My writing, and spelling, has improved since I've started posting. And there has been plenty of room for improvement. A number of the fine writers here have brought me up to their standard.
  
  But if it makes you feel better, I started a thread on 'Nominations: Best Thread Names!' at the same time I started this one. Just to balance things out. That has 20 responses. This has 58. Hmmm.

Now, if you will excuse me, I have to delete 'I guess' and replace it with 'I suppose.' I only have 958 posts to review.

-Maril

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: Marileangorifurnimaluim ]

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: Marileangorifurnimaluim ]

My dear Maril,

For the record, I did in fact read through this thread before adding my two pieces of mithril.

That I chose to respond in what some may deem an irregular manner, is my prerogative.

If ever you have an issue with my spelling and feel inclined to correct me, please feel free. However, if you have an issue with my imagination, posting style, eccentricity, or the way I choose to utilize my freedom of expression ...

Better to live and let live, eh? [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

* bows *

Gandalf the Grey

Actually, my response was directed at Ith. Ith had brought up foriegn language speakers, which we've already discussed, and the scattered occasional errors which we'd also covered.

I will edit to make it make it more clear. I agreed with you and Nev.

-Maril

Maril,

Thank you kindly for clarifying.

This wouldn't be the first time I've misunderstood the written word. The phrase "SPEAK FRIEND AND ENTER" comes to mind. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Cordially,

Gandalf

Child and Maril - I gu...I supp...oh, Deem it!

I better get to work on my editing as well. But I think I'll take a page from Bethberry's book and change everything to "I reckon"!

thanks Bb [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

This thread is fascinating

This is somewhat unrelated, but the 'I guess' vs 'I deem' made me smile, remembering a small technique for english pronounciation I once forced upon myself and still use. When I went to school and had exsams in English, I realised that I had tremendous difficulty in pronouncing the english 'th-sound' in words like 'think', 'thought' and 'through' ect. What I did in practice was replacing that ohh so common phrase: 'I think' with 'I belive' - which I found not only easy to pronounce but also (to me) sounding more true and heartfelt.

And were you saying "my gratitude is profound beyond measure, merciful sir" instead of "thank you"? [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

*Dashes in, fresh from a parade of his newly-gathered militia*

Can't stop long. We're due to be invaded (see above) and I must prepare. We'll be ready to fight on the beaches and so forth when Birdland's army of darkness comes ashore.

You cunning devil, Telchar. Such deviousness can only result in advancement.

It's very gratifying to hear that Canada hasn't fallen into total depravity since it ceased to be part of the Empire. Well done. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Are you suggesting that the Downs might be otherwise, Maril? Bethberry's on first-name terms with Queen Elizabeth; how much more polite can it get?

I think that you can be forgiven that oversight, O Pilgrim Grey. Either the message was deliberately cryptic, its inscriber's grasp of grammar was somewhat sketchy or it was a mistranslation. It should, of course, have read "Say 'friend' and enter".

I must continue to prepare for the advancing horde of Davy Crockett impersonators; so I bid you adieu.

*Rushes back out to supervise bayonet practice*

Hmm... This is kind of unrelated to the topic, but what does that 'sp' thingy mean? Everyone keeps talking about sp, so, if anyone can tell me I can leave this very confusing english grammar thread ,or whatever it is [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] .

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: Mlo ]

I think it means "spelling?", but I am not sure, as I am only a quite little Swede in the wide world after all. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

1 Is your militia very talkative, Squatter? For, as I happen to fancy, the war with Birdland's army should be purely verbal, eh?

2 yes, sp means "spelling" and is put by a poster who's not sure whether the word he's typing is spelled as it should be. Sample:

I fancy an ici-cram (sp?)

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: HerenIstarion ]

I can assure you that after gas drill, marksmanship and unarmed combat there are elocution lessons, rhetoric classes and a meeting of the ever-popular debating society. Only those who excel in all of these are permitted to take a shiny shilling to the ici-cram parlour.

Oooo...now I get it [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] . Thanks for telling me [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: Mlo ]

"Save us, O God, from the phrasings of the North Americans!"

Resistance is futile, Squatter. We will bury your dictionaries and turn your children into Midwesterners. Not only will you say "I guess", "I reckon", "I figured", and "pretty good", but petrol will become "gas", and torches "flashlights". Before long all of England will be speaking Americanese...just like the French.

Lo! Y'alls very accents shall become nasal and twangy, and all your "O's" will become "A's".

But not all change is to be dreaded. We will also teach you to barbecue, instead of boiling your meat.

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: Birdland ]

You still kill and eat animals in that heathen country? How terribly barbaric.

(Birdie packs her frog gig.)

Well, I reckon now I know why I've been rated down from Good to Pretty Good. I figured it was 'cause of my take on stuff, but y'all changed my mind.

Ah wonder whah muh PM box wasn't full of flaming fish. Mebbe 'cause they were all on the barbie. Mesquite or honey lemon?

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: mark12_30 ]

Everyone's sayin "ya'll", but I gotta point out that "ya'll" is singular. The plural is, "all ya'll". And you call yerselves hillbillies... [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

I most definately agree that topic titles should be grammatically correct. Furthermore, I believe, that a person should take care to ensure proper spelling, when posting a reply.

However, I would like to point out, that the English language is phonetically challenging. For example, Enough (proper spelling) vs. Enuf. Which, in my book, makes the ]occasional[ mis-spelling acceptable.

Birdland, perhaps we Yanks, should teach the Brits how to drive on the RIGHT side of the road, while we're at it.

[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: Tarthang ]

Hillbilly?? No Suh. I'm from Rudilin, where they put vinegar on french fries.

I'm nominating "ppl in fanfiction". Spelling words without vowels is laziness at its extreme and one of my personal pet peeves.