True, but we may be able to coordinate something and at the end of the day we could agree if it should be used.

Looking at Lalaith:

Day 1
Post 120: Quick check-in, nothing more
Post 126: Votes Legate after saying just how little she likes Day 1s. Maybe if Legate's a wolf his pack remembered this and thought her the seer?

Day 2
Post 259: Some analysis on Nog's lynch saying that he seemed one of the most innocent, but suspects Agan instead.
Posts 315 and 318: Thinking on this mysterious "itch" and the door being shut.
Post 320: Maybe the itch has to do with the secret role? And still pondering the Nogwagon.
Post 334: Says Greenie, Nerwen, and Lottie look good (two out of three there, I guess), and ends up voting Aganzir.
Post 337: Again about the itch and the hidden role. It seemed to occupy a good chunk of her mindspace this Day.

Day 3
Post 455: More speculation on the special role and Aganzir's bear trap.
Post 457: Raising the idea of a wandering special role. This came a bit out of nowhere, so maybe the wolves thought she had inside knowledge from here?
Post 458: Speculates on Legate being the Seer.
Post 460: Reminding Mith of another instance of itching in the books, in this case Perrin's itching palms for the Palantir.
Post 485: In response to Nerwen, has positive feelings about Firefoot and suspicion of Lottie. Which is interesting, based on how the Day and Night turned out.
Post 486: Vote tally.
Post 496: Agreeing with Eomer about Legate's words not matching his categories, speculation that Rikae was the seer.
Post 507: Trusts Nerwen's information, and wonders where exactly it came from.
Post 520: Again agreeing with Eomer, this time about Nerwen's voting habits.
Post 527: Short responses to previous conversations.
Post 530: Votes Lottie.
Post 532: Realizes what a point in Lottie's post is supposed to mean.

If Lal was killed for looking like a seer, I don't think these wolves are very perceptive. Hunting the ranger, maybe? Or maybe even wolves thinking they see a rival pack and offing her when they get the chance, but with Nerwen and sally still alive it seems like a terrible play. Basically I still have no clue why she was killed, and it's throwing me for a loop.

I had a think about Lal. She was playing it rather safe, so my guess (at least at the moment) is that a pack went after her with hopes of bagging the ranger. She also wasn't suspected too much, so best to get cleaner innocents (if she was one) out of the way.

I'm off for the night. Fair warning, my darlings: Tomorrow is packed for me, so I'll only be on over lunch (possible but unlikely) and for a short spurt in the evening.

It's those dang mosquitos out here. They love to eat me up.

I guess now is a good time as any, since information is going to be our best weapon during the DAY. And I've been keeping this secret for far too long.

I've been rather rubbish and cautious during the day, but quite deadly at night (and hopefully I snatched another wolf last night) I offed Mac Night 3 and Lalaith last night (didn't kill anyone NIGHT 2...the phantom and Rune must have been the wolf kills). I would like to try to convince the dead to believe me and check Lalaith next time. And try to organize the method again to relay that information.

I feel pretty good there's a few dead wolves...in fact it's been fun sort of bringing back memories of Sauce's blood bath game. Although last time I went on this wolf-slaying rampage and had to reveal, I died and we all lost. I won't say anything else about gifts (there may be a few more tricks up my sleeve, there may not be...wolves should be worried though ;) )

Ouija board time!
 

Here are the legal scrying targets from the previous NIGHT:

Likely to be scried:
Nogrod
phantom
Rikae
Legate
Rune

Less likely/'confirmed' roles:
Loslote
Macalaure
Aganzir

We still have 12 people alive, which means we can ask the role of one of six Dead people with certainty, or some other permutation that would require trimming the message being sent.

We can assign ten of us to the five on the first list, and fit the other three on the second to the last two(?) Any other ideas?

Must improve: literacy.
 

I didn't cross-post with Boro, but I didn't read it past his first paragraph/sentence while composing my list. That changes a lot.

So if Boro killed Lal, either we're down to one wolfpack or the Ranger made a save.

Or Lottie was pulling our leg and they both targeted Firefoot (and thus Firefoot is innocent). Or Lottie's pack did kill Firefoot, and I was wrong about Lalaith and Firefoot's pack went for Lalaith. (Although, I'm not sure why Lalaith would be a wolf target...they might figure Nerwen would be protected, but why not kill sally? Unless they don't think they can get sally's lover before she returns from the dead)

There's several possibilities that I'm not sure can be answered all today. I hope it's one pack now or a Ranger save, but that might not be the case.

Boro, I'm confused... Did you, or did you not, kill Lalaith? And if so, why?

Hello, all!:)

Regarding Lottie: if we assume her pack killed Firefoot, I think we can also assume she was sincere in her suspicion, and the reasoning behind it- i.e. it was indeed Lottie and Co. who killed Rune and Legate.. As for why she would openly say that- because those kills didn't point directly to anyone in her pack. (Greenie being innocent.) For the rest, though- who knows? Wolves aren't always perfectly honest in extremis..

Lalaith is surprising. However, two things stand out about her.
1. She was very preoccupied with the special role, such that it may have been a flag to the wolves (if indeed the second pack killed her).
2. She shared Lottie's reasoning on Legate (#455 yesterDay). A packmate?

N.B. As I'm writing this, I see Boro has revealed as the special role (I think). I haven't read his post properly yet.
Edit: x'd with Nilp, Boro, McCaber and my heart.

It appears that he tried to kill Lal. His powers only seem to work if he targets a wolf, so if she was innocent then it was the wolves who might have killed her instead.

I'm saying I'm responsible for the 3rd kill (Mac) on NIGHT 3, and that I also had a decision to make on to take someone else out last night, and decided Lalaith. But I have no way of confirming whether she's a wolf (and so I would request for the dead to check her on their next chance), or if I was wrong and one pack made the same selection.

I was more confident in the Mac choice, and probably took a bigger gamble with Lalaith. I took a shot at someone who was flying under my radar, but also someone who seemed to know too much, but I judged she wasn't the seer.

I just wanted to repost this exchange between Eomer and myself yesterDay, prior to my startling revelation.
#492.
#495.
Now, at this point I had not yet decided what to do with the knowledge I had been given, and was more concerned about letting the village consider the late unlamented Macwolf a dreamed innocent. But Eomer does have a point- naming those three as looking innocent *could* have looked like a hint- but only to a pack that did not contain Macalaure.Now Lottiewolf says that Mac was one of her rivals, and that it was his pack, not hers, that killed Rikae. Doesn't really add up- unless we assume, as she seemingly did, that Firefoot was a wolf and that it was *only* the comment about her to which the other pack reacted, and not the comments about Agan, Morm, Mac or herself.
I think we should consider the possibility that either Lottie switched the kills in her accusation of Firefoot and that it was Lottie's pack who killed tp and Rikae, or that Mac was her fellow.

It is quite possible, though, that I was targeted. I haven't told you *everything* yet...:smokin:

Anyway, for the moment I suggest we re-read Lalaith through wolf-coloured glasses and see where that gets us (if anywhere).

Wait a moment-
Perrin? Perrin?
Your Tolkien license is revoked, McCaber!:mad:

Oh man I am a fool. I'm in the middle of a Wheel of Time reread and I guess I just don't know what I was thinking. Obviously I meant to say young Peregrin. Mea culpa.

Nerwen, did you get any more helpful PMs last night?

And Boro, were you able to do anything after Day 1, or was killing Mac the first special thing you did? Because man, if you work like a vigilante seer that would blow this game wide open.

I did, but it was *really* weird this time- an actual riddle! I'm not going to say anything more just yet- anyway there's still parts I'm trying to work out.

Pretty sure Firefoot was innocent, though- can't hurt to let you know that.

Well I did wonder if there had been a ranger save even before Boromir revealed his need for a flea collar. As far as I can see there is no advantage to wolves killing a lover. They won't want the village to get more concrete information and they will want us to waste a lynch on an innocent for it.

Very perplexed by Kath's desperate stream of posts last thing last night not sure what is the most plausible explanation... had really found her suspicious but can't help thinking a wolf reengaging with the game would have tried to play it cooler.. anyway aware of crossposts so will post and read..

Only one post before I head out to work.

Boro--obviously, we'd like all the details of this special role we can get: anything that helps us winnow down what's actually happened in the village so far. I don't know if you're saving that or if you've been instructed to hide it or if it's part of a strategy to hide it, but clearly we'd all like more--like, what is the name of the role?

The other thing I'd like confirmation on is these secret messages Nerwen has been receiving. The impression I've got from Boro's posts is that he's had nothing to do with them, but I'd rather that were confirmed if possible.

Sheesh! Every Day there's something in this game...

I wouldn't. I am inclined to believer Boro and Nerwen at the moment and appreciate there may be operational reasons that may limit what it is wise to disclose. Obviously I shall keep an open mind at least until I have read back and see how previous behaviour ties in with current claims

So, Lalaith. There's little more about her, really, than what I mentioned already. Neither of our known wolves made any significant reference to her, indeed neither did any player, living or dead- mostly, she is listed under "no idea" , though on Day Three Morm listed her in his "innocent" category, along with me, Firefoot and Sally. , On Day One she cast an early vote on Legate for being "confusing". This would be a safe wolf-on-wolf vote, but who knows?

On Day Two she played a part (though not the only part) in getting the Agan-waggon rolling again (after it had more-or-less ground to a halt); the timing is consistent with an attempt to help Mac, but "consistent with" is all, and she had already theorised about Agan's guilt earlier in the Day:
#259.
This is quoted by three other players- Legate at #270, who says she has "good points there" but is overall ambiguous, Mac at #281, who incorporates it into his own case against Agan, and myself at #262, where I asked her how she knew both candidates weren't furry. She never replied to this, and indeed that part may have been simply poorly thought out. It may, however have been a minor slip.

Her speculations on the special role might be equivalent to Mac's stats- a way of looking busy and helpful without really doing anything. It is hard to say.

On Day three she argues for Legate as Seer, using, as noted already, the same reasoning as Lottie. After I asked for opinions on other players, particularly Lottie, she said she had become suspicious of her and also of the deceased Mac. #262. This was before I revealed what I knew, however I had implied I knew something. She said she "felt good" about Firefoot and had "no idea" about Boro and Eomer. She was impressed by Eomer's Rikae as Seer theory (#496).
Later she readily accepted my revelations about Lottie and Mac. Was equally receptive to Eomer's theory about me having a special role where I Night-kill people by voting them (!) (#520, #527). This was before Lottie confessed and could perhaps have been a tentative look at a way out for a fellow.

Conclusion: Lalaith might have been a wolf, but if so she and her comrades were very careful indeed to leave no strong links between them. Most likely packmates would be Lottie, Mac, and Nog, with Legate as an outside chance. Nothing to link her to any living player.

I wake up to read Boro's reveal!

I want to trust that you will reveal what will be helpful to us but please understand if the powers your wield make me slightly nervous. It seems you can pick a target you suspect and strike at them. My greatest fear on that is it's been one man's opinion as to who to take out without any sure knowledge or even quick way to check the results.

I applaud you for exercising caution on Night 1. I think similar caution should be exercised, else you become a pawn of the wolves. I can understand the Mac kill as I suspected him and we've since been able to confirm with identity with Nerwen. With that said I do think those powers are relatively safe in your hands. I think you are shrewd in judgement but you understand my concerns. Also, would you share why you suspected Lalaith? She seemed innocent to me.

Like Form, I would like to understand more about your powers to make sure you have the best intentions of the village in mind but then I need to trust your judgement on what you should reveal or not. There's a balance you are walking, I'm sure.

I guess I get to check Boro off my suspect list.

So the top 5 suspects on my list today are Nilp, Eomer, Form, Mith, and Shasta in that order.

We have 3 known innocents in Sally, Nerwen and Boro out of 12 total...not bad actually.

Lommy and Kath have been silent today, not sure if it means anything but it's note worthy. A wolf may be a bit silent after the craziness of the last 2 Days...although it looks like all the loud mouths are in the Dead Thread...have you seen the count? :eek::rolleyes:

Ok. So, let me esplain, no that will take too long, lemme sum up:

If the wolves are thinking about trying to put doubt to my claims, and get the village to lynch me as a wolf, that theory wouldn't hold, because there is no other explanation for Mac's death other than I assassinated him NIGHT 3 (and I left clues to my activities/thoughts, which I will get to in a moment).

If they want to try to kill me in the night (Ranger don't ever consider protecting me), I may have a another trick, or I may not, that I'm taking to the grave with me. Their choice. No risk. No reward. :p If they convince the village I'm just a wolf who's full of it and I'm lynched, kudos to them, and it would be a rather poor decision for the village to lose a night-time weapon against the wolves.

Let's start with Day 1. If you notice I've been dropping pet names on occasion, that signals my plans, just in case I need to ever go back to use it.

Day 1: I called Nog a "furry-biter" if there was a tied vote I most likely would have decided to kill Nog at night. But he was lynched and I decided now wasn't a good time to make a kill choice. But I had other decisions...

I called the phantom "strategy-maker" and that was a clue that he was someone I trusted (and believed he was an ordo) but since he made such a huge KILL ME sign all day and did get killed by the wolves, nothing special happened. The wolves got to him first.

Day 2: I called Mac "number-cruncher". This was a clue signaling I was debating on targeting Mac the next chance I got, because he was playing like the carefree, "I accept I'm going to be lynched or killed soon" Macwolf that I've seen before. So NIGHT 3 I did decide to make a kill, I had not way of knowing whether I hit a wolf or not, and so an early post from

Day 3:

This is all me trying to tell people I killed Mac, but I had no way of knowing if I hit a wolf. So, I'm poking fun at myself as some kind of maniac assassin (I only criticize how I play my role, I wouldn't do it if it's not my role to play). I wasn't going to say anything yet, because I didn't know Mac's role and I could have just put us in a terrible spot with 5 deaths in one full DAY/NIGHT turn.

Later on Nerwen though revealed Mac and Lottie were wolves. And I must say I was jumping up and down with glee. And today, since I think the more information the better, I'm saying I targeted Lalaith last night, but like the previous night with Mac...I have no way of confirming her role. All I know is I was 98% confident she wasn't the seer, and yet she seemed to know a little too much. I'll try to go back and find her post talking about Lottie and Mac, but I'm pressed for time and wont be back from work until about an hour before the DL again.

Now yesterday I actually called Eomer "den-dweller" and my idea was to follow my pattern of pet names. I didn't like the way he was talking about lynching the lovers earlier, but I decided rather later to go for Lalaith, because I always still remember Mith's words from being a wolf "don't act like you know so much."

I'm really at a loss on who to lynch today and I won't be around to defend myself from any dubious wolves who might want to try to take a stab at claiming I'm full of it and get me lynched. If that's the case, so be it, but I figured this information now will help in a lynch today and thus decided to come out. Yes, I'm still keeping certain things secret, but I have my own reasons.

Boro, I had actually thought you might be the secret role for some time, and I don't doubt your reveal, and that you are not on the side of the wolves. I hope you'll understand, though, if I point out that we can't really be sure you're on the side of the village. Just something everyone needs to bear in mind.

sorry no bolding of names - it's pain on mobile
 

On my phone again - having a busy day so I'll only be around in the European late evening/night.

Quick comment:

When I first read Boro's reveal in the morning I was quite doubtful but his newest post makes me feel better about his reveal - I'm not saying he couldn't have planned a fake reveal as a wolf since day 1 but it's maybe not the likeliest explanation. Also I'm not sure how eager a wolf would be to fake reveal and set himself up for the other pack's next night kill.

(I'm having a horrible idea of Nerwen and Boro being wolves together. :eek:I haven't done the maths today but I would think that a little too risky for them.)

Not sure what to make of the night kills. Firefoot was in the middle of controversy created by wolf-Lottie. Lalaith I thought was killed because nobody was really suspecting her and she would've been a plausible ranger candidate, but now that Boro's claimed responsibility over that (not sure I'm very grateful about that - Lalaith was one of the people I trusted the most) the speculation is over. I guess our ranger made a save last night then. Well done and good to know you're still alive!

I'll be back and properly around in 5-7h.

You know what would be hilarious? If Rikae and Legate were both Seer-impersonating wolves who managed to fool their rivals a little too well.:cool:

Anyway, from what I can work out, we should be looking for the remaining wolves amongst the following people:

Formendacil
McCaber
mormegil
Nilpaurion Felagund
Mithalwen
Kath



This is assuming Boro and Sally are telling the truth, of course, but there's good reason to think so.

Edit: x'd with Lommy.

Actually, the Ranger could have been killed last Night and still made a save- that's the way it usually works, isn't it? But let's hope not.

Well... things appear to be going well.

There's a bunch of people I've been overlooking recently, and most of them are pretty suspicious. I still have uneasy feelings toward Form and, though I'm not sure this has ever happened, I'm even starting to feel bad about Nilp! Sorry cuz! :p

Nerwen and Boro and Sally, hmm.

Shasta and Lommy are not setting off any alarm bells. That's very weird for me, normally I enjoy their deaths immensely (;)) so I'm not sure if I'm being hoodwinked or not.

Any reason you are leaving off Lommy, Eomer, and Shashta? Both Eomer and Shashta are some of my suspects and I don't overlook Lommy.

I was already leaning toward Morm being innocent after the Loslote interactions earlier in the game. He needs to re-assess his priorities, though. :p

Another thought about the Lovers: we will not be informed when/if one returns from the Dead, correct? So the one that returns will not need to post in the thread but can instead just relay all info to the living Lover via PM.

This might be unlikely but it might also be happening right now.

Of course. They're cute. Lommy is a dear little penguin, Eomer is a fluffy-widdle puppy warg, and sure you don't expect me to lynch my king?:Merisu:
I would have left Nilp off, too, save for his sorely-deluded views on koalas.

...Er, I mean, no, I can't tell you. The riddle-message I was sent indicates a certain course of action, but that's as much as I say just now.

Edit:x'd with Eomer.

Not sure, I had understood the returned lover could indeed post that one day but I may misunderstand the role.

I think he means that they can post but not obliged too and could be merely passing on information via the lover who never died. Since we are honour bound not to examine the dead thread and its post cound we wouldn't notice an absence there.

Vote analysis, for what it's worth.
 

Well, I wouldn't mind being lynched. I'm sure you all know that. :)

In fact, I'll help you along by giving you something I found in my rudimentary analysis of the votes.

('Known' innocents in italics, 'known' baddies in underline. Other than that, no time to make it look fancy. Apologies to the fans of my formatting skills.)

DAY 1

Nilp -> Nilp
Rune -> Form
morm -> Mac
Lalaith -> Legate
Kath -> Form 2
Aganzir -> Lommy
Lommy -> Aganzir
Legate -> Greenie
Nogrod -> Agan 2
Form -> Form 3
Mith -> Agan 3
McCaber -> Agan 4
Firefoot -> Gwath
Boro -> Nog
Rikae -> Lommy 2
Mac -> Agan 5
TP -> Nog 2
Lottie -> Nog 3
Eomer -> Nog 4
Shasta -> Nog 5
Sally -> Nog 6

With the knowledge of Agan's role, the Nogawagon people weren't trying to save a Wolf (one of my indicators for Wolvish voting activity, and the more useful indicator in this game). It sure would be nice to know Noggie's role, though.

DAY 2

Lottie -> morm
Nerwen -> Mac
Greenie -> Aganzir
Lalaith -> Agan 2
Lommy -> Agan 3
Legate -> Greenie
McCaber -> Agan
morm -> Mac
Agan -> Greenie 2
Mac -> Agan 4
Firefoot -> Mac 3
Nilp -> Agan 5
Mith -> Rikae
Rikae -> Greenie 3
Eomer -> Agan 6
Boro -> Agan 7
Shasta -> Lottie

I, Nilp, put Agan in a firm lead ahead of Greenie and (more importantly) Mac. So I guess I'd see why you'd say you think Mac and I are Packmates.

What was that? You said nothing of the sort? And what do you mean, have I forgotten the fifth amendment?

(Also, for what it's worth, this is twice that Eomer's been among the last voters for a lethal bandwaggon. Well, thrice, counting...)

DAY 3

Everyone -> Lottie
Lottie -> Firefoot

Yeah, not much to see there.

Well, that wasn't helpful. And my opinion of y'all hasn't changed (so far) since yesterDAY. Which means I'm most suspicious of cousin Eomer, then McCaber, but they're not so much suspicions of evil as ill-defined feelings of untrustworthiness.

...So yep, I'm still the best lynch victim available toDAY. :D

Anyway, I'm going to bed. Would someone mind putting the details in the Dead extra vote communication thing? I have the list of probable scries here.

Having been a lover in the previous Mandos game, if it's at all like the first one Kuru will mention someone being resurrected in the narration. Since he hasn't, I think it's fair to assume that both Lovers and the Ranger are still alive (provided, of course, that neither Firefoot nor Lalaith is a Lover or Ranger as they haven't had a chance to resurrect yet.)

Also I must say I'm having a lot of fun with the mental image of Eomer as a "fluffy-widdle puppy warg". Spot on, she who rules the waves. :Merisu:

Why, thank you, O Monarch of the Watery Deep.:Merisu: